Wiring Library

[noslen1968]

I am seriously considering replacing all the electricals in my Vintage Mahogany LP, but I want to understand it as is before changing it. I can't figure out what that 'board' is in the center - are those the grounds from the bridge and stopbar? Is the metal plate all the pots are attached to the way it is grounded? Thanks for your help.

[ArchSgro]

I had the same question a month or so ago but it fell through the cracks and didn't get any response. I figured it out though and recently put new pots and caps in my Studio Prem. Plus. By the way, the change in tone is significant and noticable if you do this. I didn't rewire back to the switch, only desoldered and resoldered the existing wires using the 50's wiring scheme.

Your current wiring is identical to mine. The small vertical plate is for convenience and acts as a grounding point as well as the connection to the output jack. Using your photo, the grounding occurs on the left side of the vertical plate. The braided wire from the output jack is exposed and soldered below while the grounds from the switch are soldered above. The right side is where it receives the signal coming from the switch (thin black wire)and links it to the output jack (wire with black sheath). If you are rewiring the switch you can bypass this and have a continuous wire from the switch's output to the output jack. Just make sure its grounded.

The metal plate that the pots are attached to is a ground. It probably helps in production as Gibson can fit the plate out with pots and caps and plop it right in.

The ground from the tailpiece is the exposed single wire soldered to your neck volume pot which is in the lower right corner of your photo.

[voxac30dude]

so whats the difference with 50's wiring vs modern. does 50's tyle have a better tone?

[noslen1968]

Thank you for the response. I want to use an RS prewired vintage and I wonder if it would be best (or bad) to leave the metal plate in and all the wires as is and simply take out the pots and caps together replacing them with the prewired unit. I kinda want to take out the plate and have it look exactly as vintage, but I haven't seen what to do with all those wires. I also am thinking of replacing the switch as it is 'scratchy'.

I would like to remake my photo with text indicating what each wire does. Could you please indicate what each wire below does?

Large Black = jack output
Thin Black = switch
Braided Metal = pickups
Exposed Metal (to wood) = tailpiece ground (stopbar or bridge?)
Braided Black = ???
Yellow = ???
Green = ???
Red = ???
White = ???
Thick Gray = ???

Thanks again.

Originally Posted by ArchSgro

I had the same question a month or so ago but it fell through the cracks and didn't get any response. I figured it out though and recently put new pots and caps in my Studio Prem. Plus. By the way, the change in tone is significant and noticable if you do this. I didn't rewire back to the switch, only desoldered and resoldered the existing wires using the 50's wiring scheme.

Your current wiring is identical to mine. The small vertical plate is for convenience and acts as a grounding point as well as the connection to the output jack. Using your photo, the grounding occurs on the left side of the vertical plate. The braided wire from the output jack is exposed and soldered below while the grounds from the switch are soldered above. The right side is where it receives the signal coming from the switch (thin black wire)and links it to the output jack (wire with black sheath). If you are rewiring the switch you can bypass this and have a continuous wire from the switch's output to the output jack. Just make sure its grounded.

The metal plate that the pots are attached to is a ground. It probably helps in production as Gibson can fit the plate out with pots and caps and plop it right in.

The ground from the tailpiece is the exposed single wire soldered to your neck volume pot which is in the lower right corner of your photo.

[ArchSgro]

Hope this clears it up for you.




You might want to rotate your photo 180 degrees and start looking at the guts from that orientation. Most of the wiring diagrams are set up that way and you may get confused comparing the two. Just a thought. I found myself standing on my head to look at your photo while I added my notes.

Keep me posted on how the upgrade is going.

[noslen1968]

Thank you very much - that is great! I seem to have flipped my guitar over the opposite way as most people... I will be ordering the prewired RS Vintage this weekend - will take a while to get to me as I am working in Korea.

That was a lot of work that I would have been glad to do - thanks again!

[Cacophonous]

Nice thread!!! I do not understand anything about electronics... but I do have a Les Paul copy, japanese Burny, 1983 ... and I just bought SUHR Doug Aldrich PUPs ... how do I install them? I might be confused but I think the wiring is different from every example here... they have two wires that should be welded together (white and red) and taped, which leaves three wires, one bare, one green and one black. I´ll attach a picture of the original wiring... would you guys help me figure how I should change it ?

[jonesy]

Looks to be a variation of the Gibson 50's wiring, but with the caps tied back to tone pots in more modern fashion. First thing I would do if you are not totally gutting the old pots etc. is get those little green chiclet caps out of there. Replace them with some better Tone caps and wire them from tone pots to volume pots as shown in diagrams below. IMO That in itself will be major Tone upgrade. You may want to consider replacing your jap pots with some quality CTS Pots. Just as easy to do it all now then have to go back and do it later. On Humbuckers with 4 wires generally the two taped off(red & white on duncans)are for coil splitting mods, the others are just hot, neg. & ground wires.


Thanks, jonesy

[Cacophonous]

Hum... it got clearer now (thank you!) but I still don´t understand how to solder the wires...

hot, neg. & ground wires. > Where should I solder them to ? So far, I understand that the pickup wires are not soldered to the tone pots... only to the volume ones... Did I get that right?

[jonesy]

You need to find a good wiring diagram to follow or copy control set-up from a good picture...Not sure what you got going on your end?

Archsgro took time to post a wonderful detailed picture below with everything labeled quite nicely. Be aware the picture is flip-flopped(upside down?) showing vol. pots on right, tone pots on the left. the opposite of your picture.

Don't worry about the cluster in the middle, look at how the caps are wired from the tone pots to volume pots. Also note where pickup wires and switch wires go on volume pots. This is just one of several versions.

[whytheflyband]

would this be the same on all gibson products...the 50's wiring? When I installed my new pickups in my ES135 I just copied what was there..didnt even think about checking ot any forums. My caps are tied back to teh tone pots also...should I take it apart and change it to the 50's wiring or is this only suited for LEs Pauls?

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by whytheflyband

would this be the same on all gibson products...the 50's wiring? When I installed my new pickups in my ES135 I just copied what was there..didnt even think about checking ot any forums. My caps are tied back to teh tone pots also...should I take it apart and change it to the 50's wiring or is this only suited for LEs Pauls?

That wiring works on any Guitar that uses 2 humbuckers, 3 way toggle switch and 2 vol. and 2 tone. LP, SG, 335 etc. It's up to you if you want to change it out, would be good experience and you could compare and see if there is any Tonal variation from other set-up?

[Cacophonous]

One more question... is there a correct orientation for the six pickup screws (on top of it)? Or the pickup can be rotated and no difference in tone will occur?

[jonesy]

The Pickup mounting Gibson uses on PAF's is, the screws go to the "Outside" of each pickup vs "Inside", this keeps windings and phasing in proper orientation. Look at picture of any LP you can see this...not sure how they sound flipped?

[Cacophonous]

Originally Posted by jonesy

not sure how they sound flipped?

Hum.... did I feel an itching-to-try-that vibe there? hihhihihiehe

[whytheflyband]

well I have P90's not hubuckers so should it still work and sound correctly?

[jonesy]

Yes, if you mean the 3 way toggle 2 vol. 2 tone wiring set-up P-90's or humbuckers will work fine...

[whytheflyband]

Oh yea sorry... the controls are Identical to the les paul...just farther apart.

[whytheflyband]

Ok I swapped my ES 135 around. I couldn't wire it exactly like a LP because of the distance between the pots. I made a post with some diagrams I stole from this thread and modded them to look like what I had done. But I think it gets the same results because there is a HUGE difference in tone. its so open and big and the P90's finally have that growl or snarl i thought they should have had. I was pretty darn happy with the pickups before but I didnt realize how much they were "muffled". it was well worth the effort and burning the hell out of my finger.

[jonesy]

Nice job Man, sounds like time well spent in search of that elusive ToneMojo...lol
Tip: Solder the pots, not your finger...
peace, jonesy

[Cacophonous]

Originally Posted by jonesy

Looks to be a variation of the Gibson 50's wiring, but with the caps tied back to tone pots in more modern fashion. First thing I would do if you are not totally gutting the old pots etc. is get those little green chiclet caps out of there. Replace them with some better Tone caps and wire them from tone pots to volume pots as shown in diagrams below. IMO That in itself will be major Tone upgrade. You may want to consider replacing your jap pots with some quality CTS Pots. Just as easy to do it all now then have to go back and do it later. On Humbuckers with 4 wires generally the two taped off(red & white on duncans)are for coil splitting mods, the others are just hot, neg. & ground wires.


Thanks, jonesy

Hello Joney, help me out on something... Would these be the "tone caps" you mentioned?

Capacitors at Stewart-MacDonald

Where can I find CTS pots?

Thanks,
Rodrigo

[Big_dawg]

if this is in the wrong place shift me along, but what are the three prongs for that you find on pots... Ok I know theyre to attach wires to, but what do they do (in layman's terms please)??

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Cacophonous

Hello Joney, help me out on something... Would these be the "tone caps" you mentioned?

Capacitors at Stewart-MacDonald

Where can I find CTS pots?

Thanks,
Rodrigo

I clicked on the link and those were just ceramic disc caps, IMO they aren't anywhere near as smooth as an Oil in Paper cap, Bees etc...the orange drop caps are smoother than te disc, orange are polypropalene, good for little money. Go to my website ToneMojo.com and that will link you to my Custom Shop on ebay. You can look and see what caps I have and compare prices, mine are are NOS metal cased, Sprague, GOODALL, Gudeman, PIO.?

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Big_dawg

if this is in the wrong place shift me along, but what are the three prongs for that you find on pots... Ok I know theyre to attach wires to, but what do they do (in layman's terms please)??

Just Google it, you should find several detailed explanations with diagrams, seek and yea shall find Bro....

Peace, jonesy

[Big_dawg]

I did do that but to be honest I couldnt find anything that said if I connect cap to tab a this will happen, if I connect it to tab c this will happen.

Reason being Im running cts audio tapers, 50's wiring, but still everything seems to be happening between 7&8.... Could be due to me being left handed and having to reverse the connections...

Hurry up and get another 4 posts down & Ill PM you Jonesy there were a few things I wanted to talk to you about...

[noslen1968]

I had my VM rewired, check it out Vintage Mahogany Rewire

Thanks ArchSgro

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Big_dawg

I did do that but to be honest I couldnt find anything that said if I connect cap to tab a this will happen, if I connect it to tab c this will happen.

Reason being Im running cts audio tapers, 50's wiring, but still everything seems to be happening between 7&8.... Could be due to me being left handed and having to reverse the connections...

Hurry up and get another 4 posts down & Ill PM you Jonesy there were a few
things I wanted to talk to you about...

Ok I Googled it...here is link to Stew Mac Page, Nice explanation and drawings to show what each lug on pots does....

How Guitar Pots Work...

Basically if you measure between the two outside lugs on a pot you will get the full(actual) value of what pot reads. When Center lug and left wiper are used you create your volume control with variable resistance 0-500k
Not sure what you mean by "since I am left handed, had to reverse connections" your pots are right handed pots and should be wired that way. Your guitar or you being left handed does not determine wiring. There are true left handed pots that need to be wired mirror image of right handed but I don't think this is the case with your project...???

[Big_dawg]

thanks I think googling 'guitars Pot tabs' prob wasnt the best description I could have used, there seemd to be a lot of smoking going on...

Actually page 2 of that was what I was after, so basically if I want an incremental increase in volume or tone I should be using linear pots and not audio taper pots...........bugger.....

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Big_dawg

thanks I think googling 'guitars Pot tabs' prob wasnt the best description I could have used, there seemd to be a lot of smoking going on...

Actually page 2 of that was what I was after, so basically if I want an incremental increase in volume or tone I should be using linear pots and not audio taper pots...........bugger.....

The Key Google search word here is Guitar Pot vs Pot....

Actually audio pots will give you a smoother taper that your ear hears to be correct and linear gives you more of a sudden jump as your ear needs to hear 5 times of what the volume curve is to be correct....that is how it was explained to me. I know an east coast luthier swears by a 250k linear pot for LP or SG Jr, he likes the sound it produces??

Peace, jonesy

[RCCola]

Nice. Just did the volume pot change. Burned the wood a little bit eeek!

Sounds like there is more treble. Especially noticeable in the neck position.