Guitarist that once had great tone-but now is different or just plain bad.

[banditguitarist1]

I think Clapton is the worst these days, its sad cause he used to have great tone but now he just blasts those old Fender amps and uses strats and it just sounds crappy to my ears. Clapton was a great player so I wouldnt call him overrated but he certainly lost alot of talent over the years.

[gmacdonnell]

Originally Posted by st.bede

it is strange to think about how much people change...

I just get board with the same sound day after day and I find myself changing just to do something different...I would think that a lot of these rock guys have a similar experience but since they are endorsed they are stuck with a certain thing....

I am not a fan of EVH new stuff and I mean any thing but the first five albums (if I remember right) but,

I think two factors happened to hamper him 1. drugs and 2. I think he just got more into songwritting.....how long does anyone want to play super guitarist for?...a lot of times (IMHO) I think people move away from chops to song writing

I think Clapton is a perfect example of that, as well.

IMHO, it's impossible to call him overrated, because in terms of influence, he's one of the all time most important guitarists. Hendrix, Beck, and Page, all said he was a huge influence on their own styles, and choices, and without those 4 rock guitar as we know it wouldn't exist.

But he's decided to focus on songwriting. And as a songwriter myself, I think Clapton evolved into on of the finest writers of his generation.

Not many people are so good at so many different areas of music. I'm not a huge Clapton fan. I love his early guitar playing, and I love many of his songs, but he's never been one of my favorites.

But he's made his choices deliberately and carefully, and for good reason.
And after all he's contributed to modern music, I think he's earned the right to play whatever music he wants to.

PS, Bede, I'm a big Albert Collins fan myself. His live playing was just incendiary, (pun intended.)

[sidepartings26]

Originally Posted by BCRGreg

Santana.

Yes! - lol

[Horse]

great vid of Clapton, its a shame, he should have become a solo legend on Guitar, not a commercial cop out. He forgot its the music that matters!

[DRF]

Huge Cream fan-I hold That tone/playing as a benchmark,so like a million others I find HIS strat thing lacking big time. I also think a big part of it is(after watching some youtube of the reunion concerts) that he is not always able/willing to bring his A game. Reminds me of a stubborn old man who's perception is off.

[DRF]

...sometimes brings it

YouTube - Voodoo Child - Feb 25, 2008

YouTube - Voodoo Child - Feb 25, 2008

[VILLANOVA]

Maybe I'm the only one, but I kinda like his new strat tone.
Of course, his Cream/Mayall era tone was infinitely better, one of the best ever, etc. But that tone he gets on the Cream reunion cd/dvd I think is kinda cool. It's different, but it sort of retains that thickness he used to have while playing Gibsons. Basically a strat's version of that tone. I don't find it amazing, but I definitely appreciate that tone. He was playing through a strat and his 100w Twins.

Also...Jimmy Page anyone?

[sidepartings26]

Originally Posted by VILLANOVA

Maybe I'm the only one, but I kinda like his new strat tone.
Of course, his Cream/Mayall era tone was infinitely better, one of the best ever, etc. But that tone he gets on the Cream reunion cd/dvd I think is kinda cool. It's different, but it sort of retains that thickness he used to have while playing Gibsons. Basically a strat's version of that tone. I don't find it amazing, but I definitely appreciate that tone. He was playing through a strat and his 100w Twins.

Also...Jimmy Page anyone?

Page can be/has always been a bit stuttery but can't agree that he falls into this category. I would say he has a unique tone but I wouldn't say it was great to my ears even in years gone by; a little harsh/trebely. But it's his sound.

I seen him at Wembley last year when he appeared with the foo fighters tho and his tone on ramble on was IMMENSE

[VILLANOVA]

You got to see that?! COOL

As for Page, I think starting from 1972/1973 he was at his peak and traveled down from there. His Earl's Court tone isn't bad, just not as good, from there his tone became muddy and undefined (especially in 1977) and excessively clean (everything IMO, of course).

After Zep we had his wonderful tones with The Firm..

However, he picked things up again:
Live at The Greek w/the Black Crowes
Wembley, as you said
the Reunion show

Currently, I think tone isn't bad, much better than before, but still not as good as Page c.1973

[sidepartings26]

Originally Posted by VILLANOVA

You got to see that?! COOL

As for Page, I think starting from 1972/1973 he was at his peak and traveled down from there. His Earl's Court tone isn't bad, just not as good, from there his tone became muddy and undefined (especially in 1977) and excessively clean (everything IMO, of course).

After Zep we had his wonderful tones with The Firm..

However, he picked things up again:
Live at The Greek w/the Black Crowes
Wembley, as you said
the Reunion show

Currently, I think tone isn't bad, much better than before, but still not as good as Page c.1973

Yeh had no idea. Am not the biggest foo fighters fan but I live in the UK so went along and I used to live to listen to Zeppelin so I was exstatic! I started shouting at people jammed up next to me THAT'S JIMI PAGE!!!

Page has messed about with so many amps I think that explains his ever changing tone.

[Blues4U]

I agree with Page being all over the place on tone. I saw some clips on youtube on the Page/Plant tour where his tone was stellar, it was the best tone and the best I have ever seen him play (I never saw him live, i'm talking about all the movies and clips) It was really a thick,ballsy rock and roll tone. I liked it. He also sounded good on those live recordings with the Black Crows.

That last Clapton clip was great. That's sort of classic strat blues tone. I just feel his current tone is just a little tweak away from being good. A little too much lows and a little light on the treble and it's really too compressed and mushy at the same time if that is possible. It's just sort of weird for me to describe what I don't like about it but I know what I don't like about it when I hear.

I have noticed that Mr Clapton isn't always into his performance as much as you would think he should be. I haven't seen a modern clip where I thought he sucked, he always plays well and does his thing. He just seems to be doing his job some times rather than getting in the groove and playing his ass off. I also understand he has been doing this as long as I have been alive and I am 44.

I think the fact that Mr Clapton is still recording and gigging tells me he still has a few more stories to tell.

I agree with Gmac, Clapton has evolved into a great songwriter, great.

Buddy Guy's tone changes about 3/4ths of the way through his shows. It goes from classic blues/strat tone to crap. It has every time I see him. I think he tweaks things a little about half to 3/4 of the way into a show and things go to shit. I love the guy and I see him every chance I get to because I always leave with a smile on my face. Buddy is carrying the torch like he promised.

[zplapplap]

I agree with all of this post. Well, I don't have any frame of reference for Buddy Guy's tone, but this nails it on where Clapton's tone falls short.

[Blues4U]

zplapplap,

I have often wondered if the change in tone we all seem to have noticed on players that have been around for a while is due, at least in part to their inevitable hearing loss they have after years of playing loud, live gigs?

You know, you don't generally lose your hearing totally across the sound spectrum. It seems that you lose the ability to hear certain frequencies. Maybe, just maybe, a player that to us, has an undesirable tone is actually trying to dial in good tone, or his classic tone he has had for years but what he hears and what we hear is different. Make sense?

I think this could explain why to us, Clapton's tone is just a little off. Maybe to him, it sounds like it always has. Maybe he doesn't hear the low frequency as good so he dials it in to where he hears what he wants. Maybe he can still hear the highs or the lack of being able to hear the lows makes him compensate by dialing the highs down a bit and the lows up a bit. Does this makes sense?

Just a thought.

Here's Clapton sounding good on a Strat and is tone isn't all the far off from where he is today. Just a little more spank and little more crispness. Beck sounds great in this clip, as always.

This clip is for gmacdonald. Check this out.

You Tube

You Tube

[gmacdonnell]

Wow, great clip. Clapton has a cool, "blizzard of nails" tone in it, and he certainly is giving it his all. His "Live at the Fillmore" from a couple years earlier with Derek and the Dominoes is one of the all-time great live albums, and his tone is smokin'.

But this clip, (like many others I've seen and heard,) also goes to show why, moreso than any other guitarist, I would be terrified to share the stage with Becky.
He's so inventive, so creative, and masterful on his instrument, that there's nothing you can do that he can do better and more interestingly.

In theory, if you were onstage with Vai or someone like that, you could play lyrically, and set yourself apart. If I were onstage with someone like Buddy Guy I'd use more chromatic passing notes, and other jazzy ideas, to set myself apart. I wouldn't hope to be better, but I could at least carve out a little niche.

But what on earth would you do onstage with Beck? (Apart from cry?) Jennifer Batten must have some serious female cahonnes...

[SoundwaveLP]

I still very much like Clapton's tone. It is more generic than it used to be, but it isn't "bad". I've always had a love/hate relationship with Kirk Hammett. He can sling out some awesome tone, but relies waaaay to much on his WAH.

I think, and have always thought EVH was one of the most overrated players.

[Bluesyzep]

Originally Posted by Blues4U

Joe Walsh, who I love jumps back and forth from good tone, great tone, crap tone. When he plays songs that were recorded with great tone, he has great tones, and so on. So I guess he just likes to experiment with his sound and do things his way. I respect that, but sometimes his tone is just plain weird.

Joe is the reason I picked up the guitar.

I agree with Santana too - he's kinda the supper treble or super no treble, nothing in between.

As for Clapton-I agree with everything you said-but the guy can still revert back to classic, good Clapton tone when he chooses I guess. Here is an example.

YouTube - Eric Clapton : Have You Ever Loved A woman


I think it's the same guitar-different era with what could have become a great band.

YouTube - John Lennon, Keith Richards, Eric Clapton and Mitch Mitchel

This is the first time I can say Clapton impressed me. No small coincidence he was playing a Gibson. I've been looking for a reason to give Clapton another try. This might be it. I bought "Timepieces" many years ago but just couldn't get into him at the time. I think that was the only album I ever just gave away because I didn't like it.

[Blues4U]

gmac, I thought you would like this clip-a gift from me to you!!

You got that right about Beck. I really can't imagine that there is anything he cannot do and any style of music he couldn't kick anyone's butt in.

He (Beck) isn't trying to one up Clapton, he is just doing his thing. He is really having fun and you can tell it. Actually you can tell Clapton is having a good time as well.

I love seeing clips like this where the entire band is in a groove. It is very enjoyable.

Here's another example of legendary musicians on stage, no egos, just a whole lotta fun goin' on.

This is great. I know I posted it once, but look at these guys-they are having a ball and each and every one of them was, at the time thought to be a musical God to some degree.

YouTube - John Lennon, Keith Richards, Eric Clapton and Mitch Mitchel

YouTube - John Lennon, Keith Richards, Eric Clapton and Mitch Mitchel

[Blues4U]

Bluesyzep,

Look around Youtube. There is some real good live Clapton videos out there.

I don't dislike Clapton I just think he has many faces and some of them I don't care for all that much.

[oilpit]

I can't believe no one has said this yet...
SLASH
In GnR he was top knotch, amazing solos, killer riffs, GREAT tone.
Now well....just listen to some Velvet Revolver.

[zplapplap]

Originally Posted by Blues4U

zplapplap,

I have often wondered if the change in tone we all seem to have noticed on players that have been around for a while is due, at least in part to their inevitable hearing loss they have after years of playing loud, live gigs?

You know, you don't generally lose your hearing totally across the sound spectrum. It seems that you lose the ability to hear certain frequencies. Maybe, just maybe, a player that to us, has an undesirable tone is actually trying to dial in good tone, or his classic tone he has had for years but what he hears and what we hear is different. Make sense?

I think this could explain why to us, Clapton's tone is just a little off. Maybe to him, it sounds like it always has. Maybe he doesn't hear the low frequency as good so he dials it in to where he hears what he wants. Maybe he can still hear the highs or the lack of being able to hear the lows makes him compensate by dialing the highs down a bit and the lows up a bit. Does this makes sense?

Just a thought.

Here's Clapton sounding good on a Strat and is tone isn't all the far off from where he is today. Just a little more spank and little more crispness. Beck sounds great in this clip, as always.

This clip is for gmacdonald. Check this out.

YouTube - Eric Clapton & Jeff Beck together on stage

Yeah. As I've read about the permanent hearing loss that many of these guys are dealing with, it makes me wonder what they are really hearing and how frustrating it must be. As I understand it, the people back then simply did not know what the effects of the high stage volumes would be. Clapton, Townshend, and others were pioneers in this regard. I thought that the higher frequencies would be the first to go once the tinnitus sets in. Beyond that, I don't know much about the more severe cases of hearing loss. Perhaps it is safe to say that Clapton is not hearing what we are hearing. It's hard to say how much of his tone is personal preference and how much of it is skewed by his hearing.

The great thing, of course, is that he can still play. I bounced back from addiction and has made a difference in helping others...all while helping to keep the blues alive. Good stuff.

[joek86]

Originally Posted by The_Sentry

Alex Lifeson, although he's going back to his older tones. I thought he had the best tone back in the 70's, but once he picked up the strat and started going overboard with the chorus effect, I just wasn't diggin' his tone as much.

I agree, Alex's tone was much better when he was playing 335's through Marshalls in the early days. When he sarted f'in around with GK amps and Fat Strats and way too many effects he lost it. He sounds pretty good on the Snakes and Arrows tour DVD...................

~Joe

[gmacdonnell]

Originally Posted by Blues4U

gmac, I thought you would like this clip-a gift from me to you!!

You got that right about Beck. I really can't imagine that there is anything he cannot do and any style of music he couldn't kick anyone's butt in.

He (Beck) isn't trying to one up Clapton, he is just doing his thing. He is really having fun and you can tell it. Actually you can tell Clapton is having a good time as well.

I love seeing clips like this where the entire band is in a groove. It is very enjoyable.

Here's another example of legendary musicians on stage, no egos, just a whole lotta fun goin' on.

This is great. I know I posted it once, but look at these guys-they are having a ball and each and every one of them was, at the time thought to be a musical God to some degree.

YouTube - John Lennon, Keith Richards, Eric Clapton and Mitch Mitchel

I love that video. I remember seeing it when I was about 14, and having a dream that I was onstage with them that night! Of course it turned into a nightmare when it was my turn to solo...

I know what you mean about Beck. I don't think he's the competitive type, like some musicians who always have to be "the best."

Like you said, I think he just has fun, and does his thing, which is just stunning...

Somewhere, there must be bootlegs of Beck onstage with John McLaughlin, during their respective Blow by Blow/Mahavishnu eras. They toured together and loved jamming, and by Beck's admission McLaughlin taught him a lot about improvising over chord structures and time signatures.

McLaughlin is definitely one of those super-competitive guitarists, (they say he can't even lose a ping pong game ) but he's 1st and foremost a great musician. I'd love to hear what they sounded like together, at one their (many) creative peaks. I much prefer Beck's style of playing, but he's always influenced a lot by whoever he's playing with, so it would be really fun if some of those tapes turn up.

[Bluesyzep]

Originally Posted by Blues4U

Bluesyzep,

Look around Youtube. There is some real good live Clapton videos out there.

I don't dislike Clapton I just think he has many faces and some of them I don't care for all that much.

Thanks. Will do.

[tom1965]

Re previous posts about Alex Lifeson , his tone on their most recent disc snakes and arrows , and the new live disc is Way Huge , Superb sound !!

[sidepartings26]

Pete Townsend. Don't like hiim on strats so much

[So Relax]

Slash - As inspiring as Appetite was, he has never captured that tone since. Not saying its bad, in fact I think its better than most out there, but he's never reached those heights. The Snakepit tone doen't do a lot for me.

[sidepartings26]

Originally Posted by So Relax

Slash - As inspiring as Appetite was, he has never captured that tone since. Not saying its bad, in fact I think its better than most out there, but he's never reached those heights. The Snakepit tone doen't do a lot for me.

Slash is a good guitarist but I read in the Kurt Cobain thread (backstage) someone say Kurt Cobain is no slash or Malmsteen. lol. Slash is a millions miles off Malmsteen who doesn't get much love cause people go he's just fast, which is not true. I don't advocate ridiculous speed over and over in songs with no point but technically he is amazing (although not diverse like say Vai). Both of those guys are so far from Slash it's untrue. Slash is just a good rock guitarist.

[VILLANOVA]

Originally Posted by sidepartings26

Pete Townsend. Don't like hiim on strats so much

I must second that. SG Pete Townshend is the best

[Horse]

Originally Posted by So Relax

Slash - As inspiring as Appetite was, he has never captured that tone since. Not saying its bad, in fact I think its better than most out there, but he's never reached those heights. The Snakepit tone doen't do a lot for me.

what is the snakepit tone? how do you think his tone differs from Appetite? interesting point you and Oilpit made bro

[Splattle101]

Originally Posted by Blues4U

...Keith Richards, there's an over rated guitarist...

I've heard a lot of people make that comment. I've also met a lot of otherwise competent rock players (and a few blues players, too) who can't even begin to play his stuff right.

There is more to being a great player than calisthenics.