Why replace gibson humbuckers with other brands?

[refin]

If we want to get down to it,the tones most of us are chasing were played by guys using a stock guitar,a standard issue coiled cable,and a Fender/Marshall amp.

[Goldtop75]

Originally Posted by refin

If we want to get down to it,the tones most of us are chasing were played by guys using a stock guitar,a standard issue coiled cable,and a Fender/Marshall amp.

you are so right Refin!

[Horse]

Originally Posted by refin

If we want to get down to it,the tones most of us are chasing were played by guys using a stock guitar,a standard issue coiled cable,and a Fender/Marshall amp.

dude, i sure wish it was that easy for me...... the tones i love come from artists who spend a lot of time and effort with amps, top notch effects and drives, re-amping, stereo amping, tube buffers..... etc etc......

i sure wish they were easy! Sometimes a signature tone will have some very very subtle effect going on, like flange or a fixed wah, mild tremolo, comb filter, or a combination of things which arent obvious but flavour it just a little, things that can be real hard to narrow down.... certainly not as easy as changing pups and getting the same amp...

I appreciate where you are coming from on your side of things

[TeleDog]

Gibson nowadays is all looks and no substance, or seems to be that way.

The sell stuff that's not really aimed at players but more at collectors, so any old pickup that looks the part, even if it sounds like crap, will do as long as it's a Gibson original and has that all-important logo stamped right on the plate.

I still have some Gibson pickups, but replaced the pups in the Studio with Seymour Duncans. My Standards are different though. I also installed SD's in my Epi and in every guitar project, except a couple economy builds that were equipped with GFS. lol.

[Case]

I changed them out on my LPVM because I wanted to try something different out, turns out I like it better. I went with Lace red/red in the bridge and blue/gold in the neck with a RS Vintage kit. That set up gives me a lot of range.

It wasn't like I was messing with a real vintage original Les Paul, I bought it new 1.5 years ago. Would I mess with a classic? No.

[Horse]

Originally Posted by TeleDog

Gibson nowadays is all looks and no substance, or seems to be that way.

The sell stuff that's not really aimed at players but more at collectors, so any old pickup that looks the part, even if it sounds like crap, will do as long as it's a Gibson original and has that all-important logo stamped right on the plate.

I still have some Gibson pickups, but replaced the pups in the Studio with Seymour Duncans. My Standards are different though. I also installed SD's in my Epi and in every guitar project, except a couple economy builds that were equipped with GFS. lol.

Which SDs do you use mate? i really think the 59 is so generic and un PAF sounding......

[alexx]

Originally Posted by refin

If we want to get down to it,the tones most of us are chasing were played by guys using a stock guitar,a standard issue coiled cable,and a Fender/Marshall amp.

Indeed, dude.

[AngryHatter]

Not necessarily.
The Guitar Column: John McLaughlin's Rex Bogue Double Rainbow
For its electronics, the Double Rainbow had individual volume controls for each of the four pickups and a single master volume that controlled the overall output from the guitar. There were no individual tone controls for each pickup; instead, a master tone controlled both necks. In addition, the humbucking pickups were rewound with coil divider taps so that inter-coil phasing and adjustable quad-coil phasing were obtainable with the flick of a switch. Finally, a preamp was also built into the guitar.

[alexx]

Originally Posted by AngryHatter

Not necessarily.
The Guitar Column: John McLaughlin's Rex Bogue Double Rainbow
For its electronics, the Double Rainbow had individual volume controls for each of the four pickups and a single master volume that controlled the overall output from the guitar. There were no individual tone controls for each pickup; instead, a master tone controlled both necks. In addition, the humbucking pickups were rewound with coil divider taps so that inter-coil phasing and adjustable quad-coil phasing were obtainable with the flick of a switch. Finally, a preamp was also built into the guitar.

???

[AngryHatter]

Originally Posted by refin
If we want to get down to it,the tones most of us are chasing were played by guys using a stock guitar,a standard issue coiled cable,and a Fender/Marshall amp.


And I said - not necessarily and then provided the tone I seek.
A heavily modded guitar.

[smorgdonkey]

Originally Posted by alexx

But the sound that we hear IS NOT just guitar and amp. There are a lot of other things, but the most important, THE GUY WHO PLAYS THE GUITAR!!!!! To sound better, we must PLAY BETTER!!!!! Take the guitar of jimmy page himself, his amps, cables, mics, picks, etc, and you will do not sound like him. Is that simple. Period.

Of course your playing won't sound like him.

The gear will sound exactly like his. Hit a harmonic and it will sound like Page hit the harmonic. Learn to mimic other aspects of his playing and you'll sound more like his playing.

Equipment sounds a certain way. Manipulating it certainly can and does influence it but the tone of the equipment is the palette and how one manipulates it is the brush, the music is the canvas.

This 'it is all in the hands' thing is crap. If it were then nobody would ever use good gear. The ability to manipulate it IS in the hands.

[dynabite]

Originally Posted by smorgdonkey

Of course your playing won't sound like him.

The gear will sound exactly like his. Hit a harmonic and it will sound like Page hit the harmonic. Learn to mimic other aspects of his playing and you'll sound more like his playing.

Equipment sounds a certain way. Manipulating it certainly can and does influence it but the tone of the equipment is the palette and how one manipulates it is the brush, the music is the canvas.

Sounding like someone else is easier than sounding like yourself, that's the lure.

Originally Posted by smorgdonkey

This 'it is all in the hands' thing is crap. If it were then nobody would ever use good gear. The ability to manipulate it IS in the hands.

[Pythonman]

Originally Posted by korus

And sure that Jimmy Page Peter Green Michael Bloomfield Paul Kossof Duane Allman Dicky Betts and others each has its own tone and yet you can clearly identify 57-60 Les Paul Standard with PAFs at each and everyone of them.

While it is rather easy replicating legendary Tele and Strat tones, the challange with LPs is that these common elements in LP tones are not that easily replicated. Hence the market value, hence desirability of LPs and PAFs, hence the effort for replicating it.

And every guitar player should find his own tone. But that starts with replicating great tones of those who have already found one.. In order to speak you first learn vocabulary, then grammar ... At some point one will even write and publish his own book, but hopefuly not before learning vocabulary and grammar. Because lack of knowing these is always obvious. To those who do know vocabulary and grammar, that is.

Sure, there are different languages, but learning sequence is always the same.

Agree 100% with the whole post...Very true!

[smorgdonkey]

Originally Posted by dynabite

I was wearing that when I posted!

[richedie]

I think the Burstbucker Pros are as good as anything on the market if in the right LP. I know mine sounded great with the BB Pros.

[The_Sentry]

Originally Posted by Richie555

I seems strange to me that that while people are trying to get close to that original paf sound, they then rip out gibsons humbuckers to replace them with other brands copies of the gibson paf. Surely logic say gibson would be closer to the original.

Revisiting this thread....

I dunno what it is, but I'm falling out of love with the bridge pickups that Gibson makes. Particularly the Alnico V pickups. I may end up trying a '57 Classic plus...but for the most part...eh, too bright, too trebly...no balls...

[PINKBITS]

Originally Posted by Horse

Which SDs do you use mate? i really think the 59 is so generic and un PAF sounding......

So what does a PAF sound like then

I happen to think a neck 59 obtains an excellent Page tone.

I have no problem with people not liking the 59 but to say it's generic and un PAF sounding is a little much IMO.

[kernelofwisdom]

It's just a fact that for at least certain stock Gibson pickups, you can make a pretty dramatic difference by changing pups; whether that is better is up to you. I think it is pretty clear that for certain dynamics that people look for in pickups, there are a lot of stock ones that won't cut it.

And as for standard epi pickups, say, forget it! :-D

In my opinion, upgrading pickups can make your guitar sound "better" than it did stock, in many cases.

[Dolebludger]

For what it is worth, here's my take on this, and it is a bit different. I have a '61 Gibson SG with PAFs, and its tone is totally different than a '59 LP, also with PAFs. This is an example of why I have come to the conclusion over they years that body shape, density, and resonance make more of a difference than pups -- provided the pups are reasonable (no ultra-cheap ones). And the amp makes more of a difference too.

[opalburn]

why change stock pups???


to create your own tone...

[Tonequest]

I've tried lots of PAF types, including more expensive brands like Bare Knuckle, and after having tried all these different pickups, the pickups I always come back to as sounding the best to my ears are:

1). Seymour Duncan 'Seth Lovers'
2). Gibson 57 Classics

I haven't found anything better.

[Tonequest]

Originally Posted by richedie

I think the Burstbucker Pros are as good as anything on the market if in the right LP. I know mine sounded great with the BB Pros.

Yes, I totally agree. BB Pro's, 57 classics, or Seth Lovers. They're the best pick-ups for me.