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Old 01-20-2017, 05:45 PM   #1
dwk302
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NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Here are a few changes to the 2017 historic line based on my conversation with a Gibson rep at NAMM.

Standard Historic will inherit the TH plastics (pickup covers still look like non TH spec to me) and binding color. Dish carve looks significantly flatter to my eyes. You can choose your dish carve if you go M2M. There's a new nitro that is the thinnest CS has used. The standard historics here were excellent. The necks had that nice roll the TH had. I don't know if that's a new feature or if these necks just happen to be that way.


Updates to follow.
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Old 01-20-2017, 05:51 PM   #2
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Thanks!
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Old 01-20-2017, 06:09 PM   #3
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Hide glue on the maple tops?
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Old 01-20-2017, 06:32 PM   #4
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Flatter top carve?
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Old 01-20-2017, 07:06 PM   #5
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

I actually prefer the flatter carve of my TH than the deep carve of my R7. The R7 looks better in pics though.
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Old 01-20-2017, 07:17 PM   #6
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

maybe flatter where the pickups are ...I like this type of carve a lot.
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Old 01-20-2017, 10:19 PM   #7
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

From what I was told by Gibson today at NAMM...

The Standard Historic and the True Vintage and morphing into one in the same. No more of either. The new line will simply be called Historic Reissue. They are removing the R from the serial #'s on the back of the headstock and the other upgrade appointments from the TV are incorporated into the Historic RI. All glue used is now Hide Glue. New nitro that they say is the thinnest ever. Fretboards are all now rolled. The PU covers appear to ME to be the TV spec. I own a TV and they looked right to me. Doesn't make sense they would incorporate all the other specs but not the PU covers.

He said the prices will be just under 5k for r7 and r8 and in the 6k range for r9. But he said he could not give specifics on that yet. He also said there will be option to order custom spec, neck shape, size, dish, body weight etc. And those will be in the 2016 TV price range.
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Old 01-21-2017, 12:26 AM   #8
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Second that on the hide glue. I was told a 3% price hike. Fine. The 2017s '59s felt like THs to me. They have that a certain "snap" I felt when playing TH9.
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Old 01-21-2017, 12:29 AM   #9
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deadletteroffice View Post
From what I was told by Gibson today at NAMM...

The Standard Historic and the True Vintage and morphing into one in the same. No more of either. The new line will simply be called Historic Reissue. They are removing the R from the serial #'s on the back of the headstock and the other upgrade appointments from the TV are incorporated into the Historic RI. All glue used is now Hide Glue. New nitro that they say is the thinnest ever. Fretboards are all now rolled. The PU covers appear to ME to be the TV spec. I own a TV and they looked right to me. Doesn't make sense they would incorporate all the other specs but not the PU covers.

He said the prices will be just under 5k for r7 and r8 and in the 6k range for r9. But he said he could not give specifics on that yet. He also said there will be option to order custom spec, neck shape, size, dish, body weight etc. And those will be in the 2016 TV price range.

All good news for us in the long run. Thanks for the report!
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Old 01-21-2017, 12:33 AM   #10
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

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All good news for us in the long run. Thanks for the report!
Yeah I guess the early TH adopters paid for the initial investment in the new plastics and now everyone can reap the benefits. i'm ok with that.
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Old 01-21-2017, 12:35 AM   #11
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deadletteroffice View Post
From what I was told by Gibson today at NAMM...

The Standard Historic and the True Vintage and morphing into one in the same. No more of either. The new line will simply be called Historic Reissue. They are removing the R from the serial #'s on the back of the headstock and the other upgrade appointments from the TV are incorporated into the Historic RI. All glue used is now Hide Glue. New nitro that they say is the thinnest ever. Fretboards are all now rolled. The PU covers appear to ME to be the TV spec. I own a TV and they looked right to me. Doesn't make sense they would incorporate all the other specs but not the PU covers.

He said the prices will be just under 5k for r7 and r8 and in the 6k range for r9. But he said he could not give specifics on that yet. He also said there will be option to order custom spec, neck shape, size, dish, body weight etc. And those will be in the 2016 TV price range.
Hope that is true and Gibson is back to just one Historic Reissue per year.

Seems those on the other forum say the TH's are still alive for 2017 though?? Some of them seem to have close ties with Gibson Custom Shop and seem to say differently. Guess we will see. IMO Gibson never should have got away from one Historic per model year. Truely hope they get back to that in 2017.
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Old 01-21-2017, 01:33 AM   #12
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

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Originally Posted by jlb32 View Post
Hope that is true and Gibson is back to just one Historic Reissue per year.

Seems those on the other forum say the TH's are still alive for 2017 though?? Some of them seem to have close ties with Gibson Custom Shop and seem to say differently. Guess we will see. IMO Gibson never should have got away from one Historic per model year. Truely hope they get back to that in 2017.
Nothing there nor the good 30 minute talk with the rep indicates anything about both lines continuing. He was very specific about the incorporating of the lines. The main reason I started up the conversation was due to the product cards as well as the switch plate covers on the back all said Historic Reissue. So I approached him to ask if these were Standard or TV. And into it he went.

He seemed relieved in a way to be reporting the morphing of the lines. Regarding several points he stated "customers want" or "customers were confused by".

That said, he did say, as I previously mentioned, that there would still be an offering at the TV price level, but it would be special order only, and is custom spec to buyers taste.
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Old 01-21-2017, 01:40 AM   #13
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

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Originally Posted by KBMelb View Post
Yeah I guess the early TH adopters paid for the initial investment in the new plastics and now everyone can reap the benefits. i'm ok with that.
Same here.
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Old 01-21-2017, 01:46 AM   #14
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlb32 View Post
Hope that is true and Gibson is back to just one Historic Reissue per year.

Seems those on the other forum say the TH's are still alive for 2017 though?? Some of them seem to have close ties with Gibson Custom Shop and seem to say differently. Guess we will see. IMO Gibson never should have got away from one Historic per model year. Truely hope they get back to that in 2017.
I guess we'll know more after NAMM - perhaps True Historics are taking the place of what is now called the Historic Select series (a custom order line)?
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Old 01-21-2017, 03:50 AM   #15
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

TH line will survive. I was told by someone high up in CS that they will no longer push TH on their dealers, but they will be available for order. Full TH specs will also be available through to the M2M program.
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Old 01-21-2017, 03:57 AM   #16
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

This was cool. Ultra light weight with a fat neck spruce top inspired by Joe B's 1959 EMS-1235. Bright and spanky. Very cool.

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Old 01-21-2017, 04:07 AM   #17
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Brand new model, 1964 ES-354. This was phenomenal in person. Nice fat neck.


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Old 01-21-2017, 04:08 AM   #18
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

I'm not sure what Gibson has changed, if anything, but the 2017 Memphis and CS lines feel livelier and have more "snap," if that makes any sense. I'm getting a different string response than I do with my 2014 and 2013 reissues. I don't know if it's the frets, or the construction, or what. I'd say it's an improvement.
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Old 01-21-2017, 04:11 AM   #19
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

This was from behind the "curtain." I was able to get back there. Brand new '59 Historic. The plastics are TH spec. To correct my OP, looks like PUP covers are TH spec.

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Old 01-21-2017, 04:18 AM   #20
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

New Freddy King ES-345. Don't have any details on this one yet.


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Old 01-21-2017, 04:23 AM   #21
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

This is a one off CS model. Looks incredibly cool in person. Can't see the quilt top without lots of light.



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Old 01-21-2017, 05:25 AM   #22
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

This is all great news about combining the Historics. Thanks for reporting!

The top carve changes was one of the new specs previously reported beyond adding the TH specs. Maybe top carve variations will only be through M2M as well? Did anyone happen to get more info about the top carve?

Also, I noticed in the photo below the ES-1235 gold top that there is a flyer for a Modern Class 5. Do you happen to know anymore info/specs on that?
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Old 01-21-2017, 06:25 AM   #23
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Quote:
Originally Posted by JMB1984 View Post
...
Also, I noticed in the photo below the ES-1235 gold top that there is a flyer for a Modern Class 5. Do you happen to know anymore info/specs on that?
From what i can read it says:

Modern Class 5 Les Paul Figured Top
- Brand New Model

- Apex(?) neck technology

- Long neck tenon, Nitrocellulose lacquer
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Old 01-21-2017, 09:18 AM   #24
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Looks very cool...Now you can get TH specs for what they should have cost from the get go.

Any word on R8 tops?
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Old 01-21-2017, 10:20 AM   #25
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Quote:
Originally Posted by KBMelb View Post
Yeah I guess the early TH adopters paid for the initial investment in the new plastics and now everyone can reap the benefits. i'm ok with that.
you're welcome.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwk302 View Post
TH line will survive. I was told by someone high up in CS that they will no longer push TH on their dealers, but they will be available for order. Full TH specs will also be available through to the M2M program.
thanks for the insight and info
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Old 01-21-2017, 01:08 PM   #26
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Thanks for posting all this OP . Nice looking guitars for sure .Those Freddy King 345's are fat necked , a few are already listed on Dave's Site .
The Frost Blue is also these(or was) but with a thinner 64 neck . I guess Gibson heard those who asked for some Fat Neck gits ....

The TH spec upgrades to The Historic line was posted , Here is what Music Zoo posted last week ....It's no longer up , but I did copy and save it for posting .....
So you liked the new (whatever was done) we TH owners have been talking about ????? Told you so ,,,, Whatever Gibson has done with these, if the guitar is good , it's seems to be special .... I can see keeping mine a very long time ....


Quoted from MZ:

"NAMM 2017
New and exciting things are going down at the Gibson Custom Shop. Specs are being rearranged, necks and tops are changing shapes, and everything is lined up to come out fantastic. You can pre-order these guitars starting right now from The Music Zoo. Here is the low-down about what is coming out of the Historic division of the Gibson Custom Shop for 2017! Stay tuned for pictures as the guitars arrive in the store.

Features of what we knew as 2016 Standard and True Historics are being condensed into one single series where all new 2017 Historic Reissue Les Pauls will feature:

– The Carmelita top carve profile
-All ’54, ’56, ’57, and ’58 Historic Reissues have ’59 neck profiles
– All hide-glue construction and nitrocellulose lacquer finishes with aniline dye
– True Historic parts including pickguard, pickup rings, switch washer, tip, knobs, pickup covers, and jack plate.
– Historic accurate serial numbers (no “R” at the beginning of the serial)
– Rolled Fretboard Binding
– Solid Indian rosewood fretboard
– Solid one-piece mahogany neck with Historic long neck tenon
– Holly Headstock Veneer
– Custombucker Pickups
-Finishes include Antique Gold, Dirty Lemon (replacing Lemon Burst), Faded Tobacco, Iced Tea, and Washed Cherry

-The street price for 1954 through 1958 Historic Reissue Les Pauls in both Gloss and VOS finishes are $4,699.

-The street price for 1959 through 1960 Historic Reissue Les Pauls in both Gloss and VOS finishes are $6,499.

In addition to these exciting Historic Reissue guitars, we’ll also be getting in Music Zoo exclusive Roasted Historic Reissue guitars where in addition to these new 2017 Historic specs, the bodies and necks of these guitars will have undergone a roasting process which removes excess moisture – giving these guitars a played-in sound more akin to real vintage instruments, as well as making them more stable when being exposed to changing weather."
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Old 01-21-2017, 04:46 PM   #27
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

TH's are great guitars but man am I happy I didn't do my usual impulse buys and jump right in. Now you can get what is equivalent to a TH for probably a grand less or more out the door. I was told that the 17 R8's would be in the low 4's out the door. I believe a TH 58 maps for 6 and goes for low 5's out the door on average. Wow.
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Old 01-21-2017, 05:12 PM   #28
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

Outside of Gibson giving me a blow job (NOT Henry), there's nothing here that could make me buy any of it. Nothing will replace my Patty Lou '01 R8.
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Old 01-21-2017, 06:38 PM   #29
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

I hate my 2016 SH now with its stupid R8 serial number and stupid plastics. That's it, I'm selling it.

As much as most forum posters don't like two separate historic lines, Gibson would be foolish to kill THs if you think about it. It's essentially the same guitar with much more mark up. If people want to think it's better, and can afford it, let them think they are getting the best of the best.
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Old 01-21-2017, 06:50 PM   #30
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Re: NAMM 2017 Historic Line

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I hate my 2016 SH now with its stupid R8 serial number and stupid plastics. That's it, I'm selling it.

....
Big D already has you beat with a 2016 aged R8 listing. Not a bad price either.
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