Gibson SG/Epiphone G-400. Differences?

[The_Sentry]

Eh, didn't know where to stick this one.

I was really curious about this. Some people claim that there are no differences, yet there are others who claim so many differences between the Gibson SG and the Epiphone G-400 that they don't even like acknowledging the Epi models as SG's. I've heard they're pretty much the same barring woods (as far as the design goes), and I've heard that no, they're not quite the same.

I'm sure the woods are different. But what else is different? Are the G-400's poorly balanced vs. the SG's?

I'm very curious about this.

[StrangerNY]

My Gibby SG is much more balanced that the G-400 I had was. And the neck profiles between the two were very different - the G-400 was chunky, while the Gibson is much slimmer.

- D

[The_Sentry]

Originally Posted by StrangerNY

My Gibby SG is much more balanced that the G-400 I had was. And the neck profiles between the two were very different - the G-400 was chunky, while the Gibson is much slimmer.

- D

It was chunky? Like '59 Profile Chunky? Or Just chunky for a guitar like that?

[djwilbanks]

My G400 had a very slim/flat neck. More 60s slim taper. It was off balance, but not by much, nothing a decent, wide strap couldn't take care of.

[SpinWheelz]

Originally Posted by StrangerNY

And the neck profiles between the two were very different - the G-400 was chunky, while the Gibson is much slimmer.
- D

Odd, I found the opposite to be quite true for me. I feel that the Epiphone G400 neck is not only flatter but also narrower, compared to the neck on my Gibson SG Classic to be not just thicker, but wider as well. I felt no discernible difference between the neck of the Gibson SG Classic or the Gibson SG Standard.

That said, I'm with StrangerNY on the balance issue - I never get the headstock-heavy feel on my Gibson SG, but I do get the headstock tipping down on my Epiphone G400.

[Sinster]

I went to my local guitar shop looking at SG's.. I played a G-400 and a Gibson Standard and VM. I didn't like the neck on either the Epi or the Standard. G-400 felt thin to me. The Standard I didn't like the finished neck on it. The VM neck was thicker and physically felt better and was miles above the other two.

[zeppelin101]

well im sure the pickups and electronics are better and the gibsons made in the US.... other than that i would just try them out and see for yourself if a neck fits well in someones hand, theyre gonna tend to prefer the guitar so see what you like and build preferences

[Sinmastah]

The exact differences depend on the model of Gibson SG you get.
Lets say you get a Gibson SG Standard
Heres what is an add on
Options for '66 Pickgaurd
Options for P90s
Neck binding
More finishes (I think)
Gibson headstock angle
No veneer
Probably 2 pieces, instead of 4-5
Bridge construction

My g-400 nose dives, but I use a nylon strap. Since I put on the Klusons, it has helped quite a bit though.

[StrangerNY]

Originally Posted by The_Sentry

It was chunky? Like '59 Profile Chunky? Or Just chunky for a guitar like that?

Yeah, '59 profile. I had a Korina Epi Explorer with the exact same neck.

Couldn't get comfortable with either one of them, so off they went.

- D

[Kate033]

I had a G-400 very briefly and it nose-dived. Couldn't get used to the balance (or lack there of). I've heard some Epi's are more noticeable than others on this issue. I've tried a few Gibson's (only briefly at a shop) and didn't have any trouble.

[PunkerJon]

I've had both and the difference is... I kept the SG and returned the G-400.

[Sinster]

Well I went back today again.. That faded SG overall kicks the Epi's ass... I tried the Epiphones but they didn't cut it.. Now if it was a choice between an Standard SG and a G-400 I think I would go with the 400..

[cynic79]

I've got an SG Faded and have played several G-400s. I have yet to find a standard G-400 that didn't have the weight and tone of a hunk of rock. Still, I can accept that I might have just played several bad ones.

I played a Faded G-400 a while back, and it wasn't bad. The weight and balance were good, and it resonated well. The neck was similar to my SG Faded, but a little flatter right at the spine. It was a really nice guitar for the price.

[gauchobebop]

Hi. Another difference is the neck joint.
In all the epis (included the g-400) the joint looks like the SG '61Reissue (With a small step).
In the Gibson SG Standard (and in my SG faded too) the contour is continuous, without steps.
Saludos.-

[dynamo0]

Well, I have a Gibson SG Standard (heritage cherry, MIU 2007 including hard case) and had an Epiphone Vintage G-400 (worn brown, MIK 2004 which I sold).

To me, differences are:

- Price: Epiphone was 380€, Gibson was 1350€. Both brand new.

- Finish: Epiphone has a raw, faded finish which is very nice to look and touch; Gibson has a nitro finish which is beatiful but sticky and smells a lot; and it will become scratched just by breathing on it, it is so delicate.

- Construction and durability: Both very well constructed, of course Gibson is almost perfect while Epiphone had minor flaws. Still, Epiphone can be played without fear. Gibson is simply too expensive to even let another guy to play mine.

- Tone: Epiphone featured (back in the MIK days) '57 and Hot-B pickups, which delivered a "classic tone", very nice indeed. Gibson features 490R and 498T pickups, more modern and crunchy and with a higher output.

- Weight and balance: both very light and comfortable to play. Still, Epiphone neck-dives inmediatly while Gibson is more balanced.

The rest is more or less similar, plastic parts and hardware may be better on Gibson but Epiphone parts are of a very good quality (except the 3-way switch which you may replace).

Keep in mind that I am talking about a Korean-made Epiphone. Those were good guitars but to be honest now I am not sure about chineses.

My opinion is that Gibson is too expensive and that Epiphone may be providing less quality than before for the same prices it had in the last years.

BTW, now I miss my Epipone Vintage G400, maybe I shouldn't have sold it.

[jamesc760]

I have an Epi G-400 and previously tried Gibson SG Standard as well. I thought Gibson SG's neck was a bit thicker, not thinner than G-400. Gibson SG's neck was heavy, just not heavy or unbalanced as Epi G-400, so there was a bit of nose-dive. Sound-wise, I couldn't tell any difference, but then again, I am NOT a trained musician, just someone who's been playing guitar for a long time (30 odd years). Is Gibson SG thousand dollars more and better than an Epi G-400? Not In My Book.

[captain tightpants]

With mine, the main differences are:

Gibson Faded made with mahogany body and neck, one piece neck, 3 piece body. The Epi G-400 has a 3 piece Chinese mystery mahogany body and a maple neck with a scarf joint headstock.

The Gibson has a meaty neck profile very similar to my 05 Les Paul Studio, 17 degree headstock pitch. The Epi has a slimmer neck profile a lot like the profile of my '77 Deluxe and has a 13 or 14 degree headstock pitch. The Gibby has pretty tall and somewhat narrow frets, the Epi has slightly wider and definitely lower frets.

The Gibby has the later 60's neck joint, the Epi has the original '61 Les Paul type joint.

The Epi is for sure a neck heavy beast, but a strap button relocation and a thick leather strap counteracts that nicely. The Gibby balances very well.

The biggest visual difference between the two that I haven't seen mentioned it the difference in bevels. The Gibby has fairly deeply carved body bevels that Gibson SG's have typically always had, making the edge of the body pretty comfy and rounded, particulary where your picking arm rests. The Epi's bevels are much shallowere, basically just a shadow of the Gibby's, and are more for looks rather than comfort, IMO. Not really a big deal, but if you hold them side by side, you can see the bevels are totally different.

Neither is a bad guitar by any means, but they are definitely different.

[geochem1st]

As Sim stated it really depends on model, and I will add year as well. My 61 SG Special is unlike any Epi or other SG that I have played. It is extremely light and thin.
The SG Std's are thicker in body and neck for the same time period.

I find the Epi's to be much heavier. The Epi hardware is different as well and not a 1:1 replacement of an SG for the most part. That doesn't make them bad, just different.

[AngryHatter]

Originally Posted by captain tightpants

With mine, the main differences are:

Gibson Faded made with mahogany body and neck, one piece neck...

Mine is a three pieced neck - the two wings on either side of the headstock are glued on.
The rest of the neck is one piece (all the same width).

Am I being too much of a stickler?

[jonesy]

I have owned both, several Gibson SG's and a couple of the G-400's and IME, many differences, the neck profile, the pu's, the headstock, the finish, the wiring, fret material, the balance, the headstock logo, oh yeah and the price

[captain tightpants]

Originally Posted by AngryHatter

Mine is a three pieced neck - the two wings on either side of the headstock are glued on.
The rest of the neck is one piece (all the same width).

Am I being too much of a stickler?

Uhh, yeah. Most one-piece Gibson necks are made like this, including real '59 bursts.

You have a one piece neck.

[PhilDeGrave]

I'm a hella noob, never put much obsession toward guitars , just kinda like skateboards to me.... they come and go... but i just was dealt a 1998 korean Epiphone g-400, it is better than all my previous weapons(not saying much). any opinions good / bad/ get beat, wrong thread? BTW, got it for sixty bucks , so not too worried if its a P.O.S. only had one nick other than that all's tight and shiny , and strings were intonated.any help to get me on my way to gibson-dom, would be appriecated....

[JackofAllTrades53]

Having owned both (G-400 was my first guitar), I can honestly say the Gibson SG is much better than the Epi on terms of quality, sound, feel, etc etc etc. It really is a much higher quality guitar. The neck on my Gibson is fatter (in a good way) than the Epi, nose-dives less severely, sounds, plays, and feels better. No 5 piece alder body with a cheap veneer, no plasticy poly finish, no 3 piece maple neck, no shoddy chinese craftsmanship, and no regrets.

Worth the $800-900 price jump over the Epi? Maybe. Finding a mint used one for the price of two G-400s? Absolutely. And whats great about the Gibson, no wishing you had the real deal or modding! Love mine

[FennRx]

gibson better than epi? is there really any doubt? perhaps a better question would be "Is a Gibson SG Std worth the extra _____dollars vs the Epi Version?"

of course the answer is still yes.

[H.E.L.Shane]

OK... first, let me state that i am both an SG fan and an SG snob!!!!

That being said...

We've had several new Epi's in the shop.. And i've been impressed by some, horrified by others!!!!!

One of the reasons for neckdiving on newer Epi Sg's is the solid tuners that are used.

Because an SG has a thin body and the strap button behind the neck heel, you end up with a long fulcrum length from the stap button to the end of the headstock.

Add to that the the headstocks on the eppis are slightly more massive, and you have a recipie for a neck diver.

Is the Gibby worth the higher price.... Yes... but... its a close call.....

If the Eppi was made out of better wood, I would give it the nod. That being said.... the wood quality is so inconsistant, that, a few good hunks seem to get by the inspectors!!!!

Honestly, thats my biggest bitch about the eppis in general... some of the wood that they call mahogany is so soft that you can push screw into it like you would a thumbtack into a cork board!!!

[JonMan94]

Originally Posted by The_Sentry

It was chunky? Like '59 Profile Chunky? Or Just chunky for a guitar like that?

i tried one... it was very chunky!!!

[Kermit87]

Hi i work in a guitar shop so i've played (as well as owned) loads of both epiphones and gibsons.

The Epiphone shape is based on the 61 les paul and so is neck heavy because the numpty's put the strap button in the wrong place. Gibson updated the design since and have a slightly different neck join which is both stronger and means that it is properly balanced. I've got the Gibson 61 reissue as well as a standard and the 61 is a pain in the arse for doing that. Saying that, moving the strap button to the top horn does cure the balance issues (check out the tommy iommi sig)

Aesthetics aside you gotta look at how you're using this guitar, a straight comparison at low volumes especially using something like a spider amp or a gt10 etc isnt gonna show many differences. At high volumes you realise why the gibsons are so much more expensive, the sound is genuinely incomparable. The Epiphones lack clarity and body even with upgraded pups. I used to have a korean g400 and like many people tried to convince myself it was as good as a gibson and it really wasn't but for the money they cost, what would you expect really? they're good for the money but you do get what you pay for. If the Epi's were as good why would anyone pay 4 times as much for a gibson?

If you're earning money from playing then you can justify spending more out on a guitar, if you're a bedroom guitarist then it doesn't matter half as much. If its a money thing I'd personally wait for a second hand beat up gibson which would only cost a fraction more but would be far superior.