Odd early 70's custom

[johberex]

Hi, is there anyone who can help me with info on this one. As you can see it's a rather odd custom. It has a white top with mahogany back and sides, and there's no binding on the back as the edges are very rounded, so there's no place for the binding. It has no Made in USA and the figures in the serial number are larger than on my other LP's and rather sloppy placed. All the electronics and most of the hardware is replaced so dating the guitar isn't so easy. But it has a volute, mahogany neck and ABR bridge, plus the serial number 587069 indicating 1974-75, so my best guess is 1974. I'd appreciate any help with dating the guitar. I'm also interested in how common this type of special order guitars were, is it a rarity or just an oddity. Collectable or just a great player? I'm pretty new to the world of Les pauls, so any help or comments is appreciated.

Best regards

/Johan

[Boleskinehouse]

That's definitely a custom job done by a previous owner.

[SkyDogJr]

Any chance you can take the pickups out and photograph the pickup cavities and the control cavity?

I've heard rumors that there are some odd guitars, legit Gibson guitars, that fall in to that category of "Gibson employee guitars". None confirmed mind you... It could be a non-production model that some guy built on his own time or a prototype of something they were considering...like a Custom Standard...or, Standard Custom? (usually, if they don't go in to production, they are cut up so that they can not be sold or used.)

Or... it could be a knockoff... I think there aren't as many Les Paul Custom clones out there because it's just more expensive to pull one off...so it might be a half custom/half standard that some luthier made...

So, in my non-informed opinion, it's a Les Paul Custard.

[Xavier_32]

Originally Posted by SkyDogJr

Les Paul Custard.

DO WANT. NOW!

Imagine it. Ebony fretboard with trap inlays, split diamond headstock inlay, binding on top but not bottom, 3 pickups. Oh man, that would be sweet.

And it would have to be a creamy color like custard.

[dwagar]

Since 500,000s only show up in '74 and '75, and it's a mahogany neck, I think you're right suggesting it's a '74.
I assume it's a pancake body? I can't tell from the picture.

What did the guy do with the binding removal right behind the neck joint?

[BCRGreg]

That's a 74 that has been abused. The rear binding channels are rounded over, the front binding was replaced, the whole thing is just beat.

Probably a great guitar.

[Xavier_32]

Originally Posted by BCRGreg

That's a 74 that has been abused. The rear binding channels are rounded over, the front binding was replaced, the whole thing is just beat.

Probably a great guitar.

Anyone who would play a guitar enough to beat it up like that and then do that much work on it would have had to be in love with it. It probably plays fantastically.

[captain tightpants]

I like it. Love the fact that it's had all of these owner mods done to it, but it still has waffle-back tuners!!!

[johberex]

Hi again all of you, thanks for your replies.

I've added pics of the pickup routings. The control cavity isn't much to see I'm afraid as it's shielded with copper foil.

A little more info on the guitar:
The control cavity shield has a name and some numbers molded into the plastic on the inside. These are not scratched into the plastic, but raised, so they have to be molded. The shield has some white paint sprayed onto it, so it was there when the guitar was painted.
The color is an offwhite with a slight creme/pink touch to it. Not at all like a 1974 regular white LP Custom I also have that's turned yellow with age.

Replys to some questions and comments from you:

About the replaced binding, what gives away that it isn't the original one? If it's a new binding then it also has to be a new paint job as the paint covers the inner part of the binding at some places.

It's a pancake body.

The waffle tuners are replicas, installed by me.

The rounded edge on the back isn't an aftermarket job as there's some wood left at the body behind to the neck joint, that couldn't have been there if the guitar had had binding on the back from the beginning.

Maybe the Custard is a little ugly, but it plays very well, with low action, new electronics and burstbuckers no 2&3 and 0.011 strings. It's like an ugly duckling.

Please keep coming up with comments and questions if you have any.

Best regards

/Johan

[BCRGreg]

That guitar was originally black, you can see the paint everywhere. I am willing to bet that it was stripped using chemical stripper or a heat gun and that the binding was wasted during the process, leading to the non original top binding and rounded back.

[circusboy28]

Greg's the man - in the second photo you can see the original black paint next to the binding...and in other places. It's a shame that it hasn't got the original pickups, but they probably wore out - that is a guitar that has been PLAYED for 35 years. I love it.

[johberex]

Hi, I've added some more pics to show the back of the body at the neck joint. Hopefully you can see that there never was any binding at the back, there's just too much wood left at the corner.

Thanks for all help and opinions. To sum things up:

It's probably a 1974.
It was made and ordered with the rounded back.
The binding is replaced, the pattern is not correct.
It was repainted white a long time ago, and black from the beginning.
And it has been played a lot!

/Johan

[captain tightpants]

I disagree, the photos you posted to my eyes more than back up the fact that that was indeed not done at the factory, as evidenced mostly by the extreme "shelf" left on the body side of the neck joint. Indeed, the pics above clearly illustrate the former existence of the rear binding and just how much sanding had to be done to eliminate the binding channel.

This shows up most clearly in your second pic. In addition, the rounding effect overall is just far too uneven to even assume this is a factory job, ESPECIALLY in the neck heal area.

What makes you think this a factory work other than your personal opinion? IMHO, there is no way the rounding is a factory job. The burden of proof is on you to demonstrate otherwise. Those more expert than I can confirm or deny what I'm saying.

Bottom line, it's a cool guitar, why do you need it to be a "Factory Special Order?"

[Boleskinehouse]

Indeed.

[captain tightpants]

Originally Posted by Boleskinehouse

Indeed.

Bite me, smartass. Indeed, indeed.

[Boleskinehouse]

What?!? I'm agreeing with you! What more can I ad? That was NOT done at the factory as far as I'm concerned.


Indeed!!!!!

[captain tightpants]

Originally Posted by Boleskinehouse

What?!? I'm agreeing with you! What more can I ad? That was NOT done at the factory as far as I'm concerned.


Indeed!!!!!

I thought you were teasing me about my overuse of the word ''indeed.''

Just teasing back

OP, Bole has forgotten more about Norlin Lesters than I'll ever know. If he thinks it's not factory, chances are it ain't.

[Boleskinehouse]

Indeed I was not! Captain Tightpants Wellington Bartholomew The 16th!

[captain tightpants]

15th.

[Boleskinehouse]

Ooops!



Captain Tightpants Wellington Bartholomew The 15th pondering the delicate distinctions of aftermarket handiwork. Indeed, he is a studly creature.

[captain tightpants]

You're a nut, Travis I 'd for real

Scary thing is that guy looks like my grandfather, that COULD be my future

[Boleskinehouse]

[Leumas]

Whatever it is, I think it's got serious mojo.

[captain tightpants]

Originally Posted by Leumas

Whatever it is, I think it's got serious mojo.

100% agreed.

Bole, I may just steal that pic and use it for my avatar

[johberex]

Hi again.

I'm not trying to make to guitar to be anything, it is just my opinion from comparing to other early 70's Customs I have that there was no binding on the back. But let's drop that question, it's not important. I was just trying to understand what this guitar is.

I think it's better that we agree upon that it's a cool guitar.

/Johan

[BCRGreg]

Originally Posted by johberex

Hi, I've added some more pics to show the back of the body at the neck joint. Hopefully you can see that there never was any binding at the back, there's just too much wood left at the corner.

Thanks for all help and opinions. To sum things up:

It's probably a 1974.
It was made and ordered with the rounded back. NO WAY.
The binding is replaced, the pattern is not correct.
It was repainted white a long time ago, and black from the beginning.
And it has been played a lot!

/Johan

WRONG.

The binding channel area is clearly scooped out on the heel. Why do you INSIST on telling us what is not true? You clearly don't know a damn thing about this stuff, so why not ACCEPT that some of us KNOW ABOUT WHICH WE SPEAK?

Jesus.

[Boleskinehouse]

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by johberex

Hi again.

I'm not trying to make to guitar to be anything, it is just my opinion from comparing to other early 70's Customs I have that there was no binding on the back. But let's drop that question, it's not important. I was just trying to understand what this guitar is.

I think it's better that we agree upon that it's a cool guitar.

/Johan

It is a cool guitar, but you came, asked a question, got an answer from more than one legitimate expert, told them they were wrong and it's not important. You do understand thart qualifies as strange behavior, yes?

[captain tightpants]

Agreed. Whether the guitar is what you say it is isn't the issue, your unwillingness to accept what those in the know have said is. PARTICULARLY when you asked us to help you identify it in the first place.

That what we told you is not what you wanted to hear doesn't make it any less true.

So to answer this....

Originally Posted by johberex

Collectable or just a great player? I'm pretty new to the world of Les pauls, so any help or comments is appreciated.

Best regards

/Johan

... it's just a great player. Done.

[Mildperv]

3-piece hog neck and trans tenon - that's good stuff!