FAQ: Norlin History

dwagar · 03-26-2009, 11:08 AM

On Dec 19, 1969 Ecuadorian Company Ltd (ECL) bought controlling interest in Chicago Musical Instruments (CMI) which owned Gibson. The new company was named Norlin. Gibson was Norlin's last musical company asset to be sold off, in January 1986.

Changes timeline (note: changes don't happen on Jan 1st, there are always variants):
PRE-NORLIN
- 1965 - headstock angle changes, chrome replaces nickel hardware, brazillian is no more.
- 1968 - re-release of the Les Paul, GT with P90s and Black Custom. Long tenon. Wide binding.
- 1969 - wide headstock, wide binding, 3pc neck, pancake body, trans tenon. Deluxe introduced to use up the mini hums left over from sending Epiphone offshore.

NORLIN
- 1970 - volute, Made In USA stamp, confusing serial numbers start.
- 1974 - (?) Standards reintroduced, 'white' Customs, 20th Anniversary Customs (the first anniv issue from a guitar mfg).
- 1975 - necks change to maple, short tenon introduced, Nashville plant starts building LPs in conjunction with Kalamazoo. Serial number changes to decal.
- 1977 - end of pancake body. Decal serials still used, also the start of the modern 8 digit serial numbers.
- 1981 - end of volute
- 1983 - start of weight relief holes
- 1984 - final production at Kalamazoo in June
- 1985 (?) - end of 3 pc neck

Please add changes and corrections, and I'll edit this thread as we go

Cookie-boy · 03-26-2009, 12:06 PM

Nice one Don.

Boleskinehouse · 03-26-2009, 12:19 PM

Also from '75 to the first part of '77, they used an oval decal for the serial number, model name, and Made in the USA.

'75 serial #s starting with a bold "99".
'76 with a bold "00".
'77 I don't remember, but I'm sure someone does.

An example from '76..

I'll take a better pic later.

dwagar · 03-26-2009, 12:24 PM

I've got another thread on IDing a Norlin, it's detailed in there. 75's can have both I believe, older 6 digit and newer decal.
I'll add the serial number change to this list, thanks man.

diceman · 03-26-2009, 12:24 PM

Good stuff! Pancake body did start during '69 (I saw your "?") - during '69, you had some mix and match of 1/3 piece necks and 1/pancake bodies (mine is 3pc neck 1pc body).

Long tenon in '68, Trans tenon in early '69.

Boleskinehouse · 03-26-2009, 12:24 PM

Oops! I didn't see the other thread in my excitement.

dwagar · 03-26-2009, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diceman

Good stuff! Pancake body did start during '69 (I saw your "?") - during '69, you had some mix and match of 1/3 piece necks and 1/pancake bodies (mine is 3pc neck 1pc body).

Long tenon in '68, Trans tenon in early '69.

great, thanks man.

rick13 · 03-27-2009, 10:59 AM

I have a late 69 early 70 goldtop with volute, but no made in usa, 3pc neck,pancake body,transitional tenon.
Rick

dwagar · 03-27-2009, 12:45 PM

cool, so it must've been shipped just prior to their starting the Made In USA stamp?

rick13 · 03-27-2009, 01:29 PM

I have some good pictures ...let me get them together. Don't know if it's Norlin or not?
Rick

dwagar · 03-27-2009, 01:50 PM

while it may have been made prior to the Norlin takeover, it seems to meet most of what we define as Norlin era.

(if you note in the timeline, a lot of the changes happened prior to the actual stock purchase by Norlin, but we refer to them as the Norlin era. Most might be better defined as the Rendell era - he took over from McCarty, to cut costs, cut production problems and warranty claims, etc.)

captain tightpants · 03-27-2009, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boleskinehouse

Also from '75 to the first part of '77, they used an oval decal for the serial number, model name, and Made in the USA.

'75 serial #s starting with a bold "99".
'76 with a bold "00".
'77 I don't remember, but I'm sure someone does.

An example from '76..

I'll take a better pic later.

.....'77 started with a bold "06"

murkat · 03-28-2009, 05:42 PM

"- 1974 - (?) Standards reintroduced, 'white' Customs, 25th Anniversary Customs (the first anniv issue from a guitar mfg)."

it is actually 20th anniversary.
later on they did the 25/50 anny.

dwagar · 03-28-2009, 05:50 PM

and guess who has one?

nice catch.

er, I'll have to get BB to fix it, I can't edit the initial post now.

Kenny · 03-28-2009, 11:45 PM

Does anyone know when they switched back to mahogany necks?

icsm · 04-01-2009, 08:44 PM

trans tenon is mid/late 1969.
I have an early 69 with long tenon, one piece neck and one piece body with crossbanding layer between maple and mahogany.
Hope this helps

dwagar · 04-02-2009, 11:58 AM

does that layer show on the outside, or just in a cavity? Can you post a pic? I've heard of this but don't think I've ever seen a pic of it.

zamdrang · 05-02-2009, 03:07 PM

I havent x rayed my 83 custom, but my serial # is april and I cant imagine it has weight relief holes, its a beast. Any other way to tell? Knocking on it sounds solid. Theres always exceptions, of course. Just thought id throw it out.

icsm · 06-04-2009, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwagar

does that layer show on the outside, or just in a cavity? Can you post a pic? I've heard of this but don't think I've ever seen a pic of it.

Sorry for the late reply. I cant see the cross banded layer from the outside. Ive just uploaded some pics. Hope this helps.

Les Paul Custom 1968 vs 1969

Thundergod · 07-11-2009, 01:37 PM

Wasn't called Ecuadorian Company Ltd. it was called Cervezas Nacionales del Ecuador, and it's to date the main beer producer of Ecuador and most of Latin America.

(I'm from and live in Ecuador and my family's had stock of what now is called Cervecería Nacional del Ecuador for a long time).

Eric · 07-12-2009, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thundergod

Wasn't called Ecuadorian Company Ltd. it was called Cervezas Nacionales del Ecuador, and it's to date the main beer producer of Ecuador and most of Latin America.

(I'm from and live in Ecuador and my family's had stock of what now is called Cervecería Nacional del Ecuador for a long time).

now that's awesome

SKATTERBRANE · 07-12-2009, 12:06 AM

SN for 1977 = 06 prefix.

SKATTERBRANE · 07-12-2009, 12:07 AM

I had a 1983 Standard with a 3-piece maple neck and no volute.

honeyburstpaul · 10-16-2009, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diceman

Good stuff! Pancake body did start during '69 (I saw your "?") - during '69, you had some mix and match of 1/3 piece necks and 1/pancake bodies (mine is 3pc neck 1pc body).

Long tenon in '68, Trans tenon in early '69.

What do you mean by pancake body?

Ace Warslave · 10-16-2009, 07:46 AM

ok..now this gets rather confusing my ebony custom date stamped as 963###.and it has a 3 peice mapel neck pot code suggest that it is a 74..13774#..and of course it doesnt have the dot over the i..

03-26-2009, 11:08 AM	#1 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 4,961 Thanks: 28 Thanked 51 Times in 9 Posts	FAQ: Norlin History On Dec 19, 1969 Ecuadorian Company Ltd (ECL) bought controlling interest in Chicago Musical Instruments (CMI) which owned Gibson. The new company was named Norlin. Gibson was Norlin's last musical company asset to be sold off, in January 1986. Changes timeline (note: changes don't happen on Jan 1st, there are always variants): PRE-NORLIN - 1965 - headstock angle changes, chrome replaces nickel hardware, brazillian is no more. - 1968 - re-release of the Les Paul, GT with P90s and Black Custom. Long tenon. Wide binding. - 1969 - wide headstock, wide binding, 3pc neck, pancake body, trans tenon. Deluxe introduced to use up the mini hums left over from sending Epiphone offshore. NORLIN - 1970 - volute, Made In USA stamp, confusing serial numbers start. - 1974 - (?) Standards reintroduced, 'white' Customs, 20th Anniversary Customs (the first anniv issue from a guitar mfg). - 1975 - necks change to maple, short tenon introduced, Nashville plant starts building LPs in conjunction with Kalamazoo. Serial number changes to decal. - 1977 - end of pancake body. Decal serials still used, also the start of the modern 8 digit serial numbers. - 1981 - end of volute - 1983 - start of weight relief holes - 1984 - final production at Kalamazoo in June - 1985 (?) - end of 3 pc neck Please add changes and corrections, and I'll edit this thread as we go __________________ ------------ Don my favorite toys (one wants to be a '59, the other is a '59): Last edited by b-squared; 03-28-2009 at 07:58 PM.

03-26-2009, 12:06 PM	#2 (permalink)
Cookie-boy Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Under the care, custody and control of Matron. Posts: 6,708 Thanks: 146 Thanked 687 Times in 172 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History Nice one Don. __________________ "No Tone Mouse? No Tone, Baby!"

03-26-2009, 12:19 PM	#3 (permalink)
Boleskinehouse V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Next to Raleighwood Posts: 17,736 Thanks: 63 Thanked 506 Times in 90 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History Also from '75 to the first part of '77, they used an oval decal for the serial number, model name, and Made in the USA. '75 serial #s starting with a bold "99". '76 with a bold "00". '77 I don't remember, but I'm sure someone does. An example from '76.. I'll take a better pic later. __________________

03-26-2009, 12:24 PM	#4 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 4,961 Thanks: 28 Thanked 51 Times in 9 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History I've got another thread on IDing a Norlin, it's detailed in there. 75's can have both I believe, older 6 digit and newer decal. I'll add the serial number change to this list, thanks man. __________________ ------------ Don my favorite toys (one wants to be a '59, the other is a '59):

03-26-2009, 12:24 PM	#5 (permalink)
diceman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 16,308 Thanks: 307 Thanked 90 Times in 32 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History Good stuff! Pancake body did start during '69 (I saw your "?") - during '69, you had some mix and match of 1/3 piece necks and 1/pancake bodies (mine is 3pc neck 1pc body). Long tenon in '68, Trans tenon in early '69. __________________ My Band: www.comeupswingingmusic.com or www.myspace.com/comeupswinging

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03-26-2009, 12:24 PM	#6 (permalink)
Boleskinehouse V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Next to Raleighwood Posts: 17,736 Thanks: 63 Thanked 506 Times in 90 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History Oops! I didn't see the other thread in my excitement. __________________

03-27-2009, 10:59 AM	#8 (permalink)
rick13 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 342 Thanks: 0 Thanked 13 Times in 2 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History I have a late 69 early 70 goldtop with volute, but no made in usa, 3pc neck,pancake body,transitional tenon. Rick

03-27-2009, 12:45 PM	#9 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 4,961 Thanks: 28 Thanked 51 Times in 9 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History cool, so it must've been shipped just prior to their starting the Made In USA stamp? __________________ ------------ Don my favorite toys (one wants to be a '59, the other is a '59):

03-27-2009, 01:29 PM	#10 (permalink)
rick13 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 342 Thanks: 0 Thanked 13 Times in 2 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History I have some good pictures ...let me get them together. Don't know if it's Norlin or not? Rick

03-27-2009, 01:50 PM	#11 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 4,961 Thanks: 28 Thanked 51 Times in 9 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History while it may have been made prior to the Norlin takeover, it seems to meet most of what we define as Norlin era. (if you note in the timeline, a lot of the changes happened prior to the actual stock purchase by Norlin, but we refer to them as the Norlin era. Most might be better defined as the Rendell era - he took over from McCarty, to cut costs, cut production problems and warranty claims, etc.) __________________ ------------ Don my favorite toys (one wants to be a '59, the other is a '59):

03-28-2009, 05:42 PM	#13 (permalink)
murkat V.I.P. Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Nashville Posts: 207 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History "- 1974 - (?) Standards reintroduced, 'white' Customs, 25th Anniversary Customs (the first anniv issue from a guitar mfg)." it is actually 20th anniversary. later on they did the 25/50 anny.

03-28-2009, 05:50 PM	#14 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 4,961 Thanks: 28 Thanked 51 Times in 9 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History and guess who has one? nice catch. er, I'll have to get BB to fix it, I can't edit the initial post now. __________________ ------------ Don my favorite toys (one wants to be a '59, the other is a '59):

03-28-2009, 11:45 PM	#15 (permalink)
Kenny Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: California Posts: 283 Thanks: 27 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History Does anyone know when they switched back to mahogany necks?

04-01-2009, 08:44 PM	#16 (permalink)
icsm Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 129 Thanks: 1 Thanked 8 Times in 3 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History trans tenon is mid/late 1969. I have an early 69 with long tenon, one piece neck and one piece body with crossbanding layer between maple and mahogany. Hope this helps __________________ '64 Fender Jaguar '68 Gibson Les Paul Custom '68/69 Gibson Les Paul Custom '89 Gibson Les Paul Reissue '89 PRS Custom 24 '05 PRS Custom 24

04-02-2009, 11:58 AM	#17 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 4,961 Thanks: 28 Thanked 51 Times in 9 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History does that layer show on the outside, or just in a cavity? Can you post a pic? I've heard of this but don't think I've ever seen a pic of it. __________________ ------------ Don my favorite toys (one wants to be a '59, the other is a '59):

05-02-2009, 03:07 PM	#18 (permalink)
zamdrang Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 11 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 1 Post	Re: FAQ: Norlin History I havent x rayed my 83 custom, but my serial # is april and I cant imagine it has weight relief holes, its a beast. Any other way to tell? Knocking on it sounds solid. Theres always exceptions, of course. Just thought id throw it out.

07-11-2009, 01:37 PM	#20 (permalink)
Thundergod Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 432 Thanks: 5 Thanked 12 Times in 2 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History Wasn't called Ecuadorian Company Ltd. it was called Cervezas Nacionales del Ecuador, and it's to date the main beer producer of Ecuador and most of Latin America. (I'm from and live in Ecuador and my family's had stock of what now is called Cervecería Nacional del Ecuador for a long time).

07-12-2009, 12:06 AM	#22 (permalink)
SKATTERBRANE Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 6,874 Thanks: 62 Thanked 91 Times in 36 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History SN for 1977 = 06 prefix. __________________ https://www.skatterbrane.com/pickups/index.php

07-12-2009, 12:07 AM	#23 (permalink)
SKATTERBRANE Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 6,874 Thanks: 62 Thanked 91 Times in 36 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History I had a 1983 Standard with a 3-piece maple neck and no volute. __________________ https://www.skatterbrane.com/pickups/index.php

10-16-2009, 07:46 AM	#25 (permalink)
Ace Warslave Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 242 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: FAQ: Norlin History ok..now this gets rather confusing my ebony custom date stamped as 963###.and it has a 3 peice mapel neck pot code suggest that it is a 74..13774#..and of course it doesnt have the dot over the i..

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