warping wood problem!

[Horse]

Guys, i know im going to sound a complete newb buttmunch..... but hell...

Got a problem, bought my wood for my LP build, had it laying in my spare room, not too hot or cold, not too dry, but the maple boards are warping... can i save it? how do i get it flat again? I dont have a thicknesser at home, its the right thickness already.

And how should i then store it till working on?

cheers

[Gothika777]

It happened to my maple top as well. It don't know how its doing at the mo. I left the two pices clamped against eachother so they would go flat (inorder to relieve the pressure of the clamps) and so the air could circulate round the two pieces. I am going back home this weekend so I can see if it worked or not. They've been left like it for a month

[Horse]

Think i will clamp mine to the Utile blank mate..... might help...

[w666]

Apply moisture (damp cloth) to the concave side of the warped board. Another way to do this is to lay the board out on the damp grass of the morning dew or maybe even freshly fallen snow as the case may be). If you're lucky, the board might straighten out. It depends on whether the warp is "cupping" or "bowing". If it's "twisting", you're pretty well screwed.

http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_bas...in_Drying.html

If you can straighten it with moisture, then maybe you can clamp it flat against its mate, making sure that you "sticker" it so that air can flow in between and it can dry slowly at the same rate on both sides. This may take a while....like a season or two. Trying to force it flat 'til you can glue it up to the body is a strategy fraught with peril!

Wood warps for a variety of reasons, many of which have to do with how it was dried in the first place. Sometimes otherwise flat boards will warp after machining (as in book matching, or thickness planing) one side, but not the other, exposing inner surfaces that are not as dry as the outer surface. Air dried woods are more susceptible to this than kiln dried woods.

Highly figured woods are often "compression woods" which may contain built in stress as the result of having been formed while that part of the tree grew in directions anything but vertical. Once sawn or re-sawn they can behave in all sorts of unpredictable ways.

Wood is really interesting stuff!

[Horse]

w666,

Thanks mate, interesting stuff, and unfortunate, ive seen the wood is slightly twisted too...i guess i will have to get some more, and glue it straight away to the body!

[ihavenofish]

Originally Posted by Horse

w666,

Thanks mate, interesting stuff, and unfortunate, ive seen the wood is slightly twisted too...i guess i will have to get some more, and glue it straight away to the body!

maple i find very malleable. get a spray bottle and wet both sides, then clamp it to something flat and rigid and let it drie.

i had a 1/4" top that i wet to see the figure and it cupped 1/2"! i just wet it again, and clamped the 2 halves together with tape and it dried in its new position.

once its glued to a body back, it will stay put as well, since the maple is much thinner and more flexible than the mahogany.

[Gothika777]

If my wood hasn't gone flat when I go back I'll try wetting it with warm water with a cloth and then I'll clamp the 2 pieces together. Hopefully that won't be the case but it would be nice to know what works but again its something that only time can tell

[Horse]

Originally Posted by ihavenofish

maple i find very malleable. get a spray bottle and wet both sides, then clamp it to something flat and rigid and let it drie.

i had a 1/4" top that i wet to see the figure and it cupped 1/2"! i just wet it again, and clamped the 2 halves together with tape and it dried in its new position.

once its glued to a body back, it will stay put as well, since the maple is much thinner and more flexible than the mahogany.

Thanks dude, i shall go try it! and let you know.

[Gothika777]

I've just got home and my woods still warped. How much water should I apply to it and how many clamps should I use?

[ihavenofish]

Originally Posted by Gothika777

I've just got home and my woods still warped. How much water should I apply to it and how many clamps should I use?

"i dont know". sorry, thats as close as i can suggest. every peice of wood is different.

those pretty purpleheart fretboards i showed in the other thread have no managed to get a little cup and bow from being in my apartment for 2 whole days. when they get to the shop next week, they will sit for a few more days to accept that climate, then get a spray with water and flattened between some mdf sticks with some heavy weight on top (with gaps between each board for air curculation).

the only thing the water does is allow the fibres to relax into its new shape rather then being under tension after the guitar is built - which can lead to warping later. i probably wouldnt even bother flattening the purpleheart beforehand if it was a hand build, but it helps them stay put on the cnc better if they are perfectly flat.

[Gothika777]

I did try earlier with some hot water on a cloth and then I clamped it between some of them plywood with some of those quick release clamps, but no avail.

This 1/4" inch piece of maple is kinda getting to me now so thats why I ask. I've decided to go more brutal with more hot water and with the clamps I was using before and also with some g-clamps. Maybe the clamps before could not apply enough pressure, I dunno really.

[ihavenofish]

Originally Posted by Gothika777

I did try earlier with some hot water on a cloth and then I clamped it between some of them plywood with some of those quick release clamps, but no avail.

This 1/4" inch piece of maple is kinda getting to me now so thats why I ask. I've decided to go more brutal with more hot water and with the clamps I was using before and also with some g-clamps. Maybe the clamps before could not apply enough pressure, I dunno really.

1 thing to keep in mind, when you clamp it.. you dont just leave it for an hour. you want to leave it for at least a week or 2 to settle.

[Gothika777]

Don't u just leave it till it dries?

Anyway I''ll be leaving it for 5 weeks this time as I can't really do anything else to it, so if it doesn't work then I'll just have to get some more maple

[ihavenofish]

Originally Posted by Gothika777

Don't u just leave it till it dries?

Anyway I''ll be leaving it for 5 weeks this time as I can't really do anything else to it, so if it doesn't work then I'll just have to get some more maple

yes, you leave it til it dries.. that takes more than an hour. it might look dry on the surface, but youve basically re-introduced moisture into the wood. not quite like green wood, but somewhere in between.

how bad exactly is the warp?

[Gothika777]

Its only one half of my bookmatched top. There are pictures on by my build thread. Its kinda keeping me from progressing. The pics can be found here. LP JR DC build attempt

If u put a ruler across the board, the maximum difference between the ruler and the board is about 2.5mm

[ihavenofish]

you put a mahogany neck in the snow....
*cough*

anyhow.. that wood is fine as long as its already planed. joint it tangent to the curve, glue the top together, then glue it down to the body with alot of even weight and move on with the build.

wood moves. period. its unavoidable and uncontrolable for the most part, and maple is one of the absolute worst for this (purpleheart is the only one more annoying ive found). just gotta keep going. the glue will damp the wood again, and it will relax into its new shape.

what you DONT want to do is try to compensate for little things like that. for example taking that board and planing it flat. it would just cup the opposite way after you relieve the stress on one side.

i have a 6"wide 1/4" thick purpleheart board cupped literally an inch. it will become a drop top eventually, and will be flattened well.

[Gothika777]

Well the problem is that I need to plane the sides of it to get a good glue line and i can only do that when its flat.

Oh btw I didn't put it in the snow for very long- I know its not good. Outside is the only good place for me to take pictures as its too dark inside for the camera

[ihavenofish]

Originally Posted by Gothika777

Well the problem is that I need to plane the sides of it to get a good glue line and i can only do that when its flat.

Oh btw I didn't put it in the snow for very long- I know its not good. Outside is the only good place for me to take pictures as its too dark inside for the camera

so the maple isnt smooth already then? yeah, then youll have to plane it flat. youll need to try to take equal amounts on both sides.

[Gothika777]

Also the thickness is not constant accross the width of the board. I'll think I'll wait untill I see if my wetting/clamping trick works first, but yes that would be my last resort.

[theodoropoulos]

You Tube

You Tube

maybe you could get an idea for bringing back the wood...

[Gothika777]

I guess u could wet the wood and apply a metal electric heat blanket and clamp it between some ply wood, sorta like they do with acoustic guitar molds for bendifng the sides but its not really worth it for one piece.

[ihavenofish]

Originally Posted by Gothika777

I guess u could wet the wood and apply a metal electric heat blanket and clamp it between some ply wood, sorta like they do with acoustic guitar molds for bendifng the sides but its not really worth it for one piece.

would work either.

the steaming is for bending along the grain, and its far from precise.

[Gothika777]

Here's an update

Before:



clamping the shit out of it (after dampening with warm water)



After:



(pls excuse the state of my dad's fingernails)

[Horse]

Gothika,

cheers buddy! i was just gonna post pics and ask again! i will give that a go mate.

[Gothika777]

As a reference I used like a mug of hot water in conjunction with a cloth to dampen the wood.

[Horse]

I received Tom's plans. And went about starting to make a template.......probably using a method found wanting by others!




not looking bad.....


until......


dont know what happened, 4 hours of painstaking tracing and sanding, somehow it got distorted I guess i woulda been put right if id floated using this method beforehand. But i did learn that i could do a fair job of sanding - thats something!

Now i will default to cutting toms plans out and using them directly to mark out pieces, then purchase another fresh set from him.

[monsterwalley]

That sucks man. I've been there.

[Horse]

Originally Posted by monsterwalley

That sucks man. I've been there.

sure does man....hey its a learing process right

I decided to start a new thread for this build.