"camille" small build

[monsterwalley]

As the title states This guitar will be for my daughter "Cami". Hopefully I get it done by her birthday. Oct 17

I really liked how pinefd's guitars look and casey's (greasebox). Can't forget his

I rounded up some wood from northridge for the build and am sitting with the stewmac book in front of me getting ready to order parts.

I have a couple of questions to start and probably many more as I go.

What is everybody's opinion on frets for a 9 year old girl? Anything I should
lean toward's to help her out as far as size goes?

Also, As far as the neck, I plan on doing the 20.7" scale as pinefd but was wondering if I should make the neck a little narrower, but still able to cover the poles of the pickups?

Any advice would be appreciated, I want to make this playable for her if she wants to take lessons as well as being an eirloom <sp> for her to hang on to.

I also need to figure out what to put on the headstock, Not doing the gibby logo this time. Maybe "Camille" in script out of mop? I also like "small paul" and "les tall" for the silk screening but obviously they are taken.
I'd like to hear any ideas if anybody has any.

Thanks in advance!!

[pinefd]

Walley,

Glad to hear you're doing a small build! Just let me know if there's anything I can do to help.

With regard to your questions, I'll give it my best shot. I'd go with something like Dunlop 6105 frets which are relatively narrow, but tall. It should make it easier for her to fret the strings. With regard to neck size, I'd keep it close to full width, maybe just a touch under full size, if you feel the need to make it a little smaller. I kept mine full size, but a very comfortable full size, and the combination of the shorter scale length, smaller body and not too large neck size, make it the perfect size for my 10 year old daughter. Don't forget, kids grow up way too fast these days, and you want this guitar to be able to grow with her. Your headstock question I'll have to think about.

Good luck, and have fun! Oh, and is this going to be a surprise for her, or does she know about it? And if she knows about it, are you going to let her help choose the color?


Frank

[monsterwalley]

Thanks for the advice Frank! I'm sure I'll probably bother you to death on this build, But it looks like you've got er down!

Originally Posted by pinefd

Good luck, and have fun! Oh, and is this going to be a surprise for her, or does she know about it? And if she knows about it, are you going to let her help choose the color?


Frank

Yes this is a surprise so far. I never gave it any thought about her picking out the color. I know she loves mine I've been building, but I would do more color on hers. I'll have to give that some thought The only drawback would be if I screwed it up I couldn't throw it out and race over to walmart and get her something If she is involved then I'm sunk (no pressure)

[Ole'Lefty]

Would you like me to measure my Edwards small Black Beauty? I believe Frank has used some proportions from such a guitar. It would have to be later today- this is my last official scheduled day for court as a judge. O'L

[GreaseBox]

Dude, I'm STOKED!!!!

This will be sweet! Man I read Frank's "small scale build update" thread religously when planning mine. It helped alot!

If I can help you in any way, don't hesitate to let me know! You know I owe you one!

Peace Bro!

[monsterwalley]

Originally Posted by Ole'Lefty

Would you like me to measure my Edwards small Black Beauty? I believe Frank has used some proportions from such a guitar. It would have to be later today- this is my last official scheduled day for court as a judge. O'L

That would be great lefty!, any information I can get is greatly appreciated!

But since this is your last day as judge maybe you should treat yourself to some fishing of the marble eye on those wingdams I keep hearing about

[monsterwalley]

Originally Posted by GreaseBox

Dude, I'm STOKED!!!!

This will be sweet! Man I read Frank's "small scale build update" thread religously when planning mine. It helped alot!

If I can help you in any way, don't hesitate to let me know! You know I owe you one!

Peace Bro!

Thanks Cacey! I'm sure I'll have plenty of questions. I want to make sure it
plays real easy for her. + I can't wait to see the instructors mouth drop when (if) she gets lessons and drags in a "small Paul".

[monsterwalley]

Well I got some lumber in today. I don't know exactly how I feel about the top though..... I like it but it seems the grain is too tight in the center and highlights the center too much, if that makes sense? Does anyone have an opinion on this?

The mahogany also has me concerned, seems a little heavy. I was wondering if I should weight relieve it since it will be for a little girl?













Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[GreaseBox]

I think the maple looks fantastic man! I would def use it. As far as chambering, if you think it's going to be too heavy, I say go for it. But really what do I know? You may want to get more opinions.

Is your daughter into the color pink? What about a pink burst???

:edit:

Example:

[monsterwalley]

Originally Posted by GreaseBox

I think the maple looks fantastic man! I would def use it. As far as chambering, if you think it's going to be too heavy, I say go for it. But really what do I know? You may want to get more opinions.

Is your daughter into the color pink? What about a pink burst???

:edit:

Example:

Hey grease......
Pink was the first thing I came up with also. My concern is it being too stereotypical ( girl=pink ) if you know what I mean. I need to set her down and let her see what she likes out of catalogues as far as Idea's.
I am afraid of it being too "Barbie" My thoughts were more of a brockburst personally.

I also think it would be cool to come up with a duck logo for the headstock out of mop, kinda like the "ducks unlimited logo" She has a thing for ducks ever since day one. Her duck collection is unreal, so it would personalize it more for her. Then was thinking of doing "camille" in lespaul style script.
I thought about doing the inlays like ducks but that would be way over the top I'm afraid.

The mahogany right now is around 12 pounds. But it's 2" thick and is plenty big for a full size build. My girl is smallish in stature (for a girl her age) so
that is why I am considering weight relieving.



Any ideas, throw them at me. Pleeeeaaaze

[gibbbbbbbaaaay!!!]

Awesome man! That's a real good thing you're doing! Brockburst would be pretty cool. I just want to say good luck on the build and would like mention another finish idea: Heritage Cherry Sunburst. But it's about what she wants so I don't really have any say. But anyway, I'll stay tuned!

[MRJ5]

That maple is going to be outstanding and it is a great idea reducing the scale to fit her.

If you are afraid pink is too stereotypical why not a lavender burst or lavender tiger.

Better yet have a casual conversation with her and find out her favorite color(s). Also you could do something with a unique pattern or airbrush refecting her taste / color choice. Kids love personalized things as well. I think either a "Camille" or "Cami" inlay or decal would be a great idea.

[GreaseBox]

Originally Posted by monsterwalley

I also think it would be cool to come up with a duck logo for the headstock ...

Just throwing you an idea:

What about the silhouette of a rubber ducky?

[monsterwalley]

Originally Posted by MRJ5

Better yet have a casual conversation with her and find out her favorite color(s). Also you could do something with a unique pattern or airbrush refecting her taste / color choice. Kids love personalized things as well. I think either a "Camille" or "Cami" inlay or decal would be a great idea.
]

I did set her down a little bit last night. Orange is her favorite color, she liked all the ones that were stained orange. To me I don't like just the orange, it looks too much like my wifes ibanez. But.... it's her guitar not mine. I'm pretty much set on doing her name in place of the les paul script and doing something with the duck in mop.


Casey.......... cool Idea, Keep em coming! I'm thinking something a little more like the ducks unlimited type of logo. More along the lines of line art if that makes sense.

Thanks for the input guys!

[Nelson674]

that top looks great! i do see what you mean about the tight grain in the center. however i think once you get the hardware and pickups on you wont notice it as much, its really not that noticeable anyway.personally my eyes are attracted to the figuring much more then the grain.

good luck! cant wait to see some progress pitures!


Nelson

[pinefd]

I would seriously consider chambering the guitar, if I were you. And I'd chamber it similar to how the Chambered Reissues are (if you need a pic of that, we can dig one up for you). My travel guitar ended up at 6 lbs., 7 oz., and I'm thinking that the next one I do, I will likely chamber it.

Regarding the top wood, I think it looks nice. But I'm also thinking that for a nice orange look, that isn't too orangy looking, you could go with more of a tiger eye color scheme, and that usually looks best on quilted maple or deeper flame. Here's an example:




Frank

[monsterwalley]

Damn........... That's nice. I love it Frank! I agree that the wood I have could not pull that off. I will have nice size drops that I can try on though. I think I know what you are talking about on the chambering. I am looking for pics but isnt the horn area routed out then around the upper hip area routed out also? I've seen them around before. I pretty much made up my mind to do it though.(Chamber it)

Frank I also had a question on your truss rod. I read on your post and don't quite grasp exactly what you did. (Thick headed) I know you mentioned running the TR closer to the back of the neck instead of the fretboard, but you lost me when you talked about putting a block of wood at the nut when you route it on the table. Does that mean it actually tapers from the anchor up to where it exits the headstock?
Can I run a curved TR on this one like I did my full size?

[monsterwalley]

I came up with an idea for the mop on the headstock

What's yer all's opinion?



Sorry for the crappy pic, I sketched it out and just took a pic

[monsterwalley]

Originally Posted by Nelson674

that top looks great! i do see what you mean about the tight grain in the center. however i think once you get the hardware and pickups on you wont notice it as much, its really not that noticeable anyway.personally my eyes are attracted to the figuring much more then the grain.

good luck! cant wait to see some progress pitures!


Nelson

Thanks for your input Nelson! Greatly appreciated

[monsterwalley]

Is this what you are referring to Frank? The top pic not the "weight relieved" pic below it.


Gibson Les Paul 101

[pinefd]

Originally Posted by monsterwalley

Damn........... That's nice. I love it Frank! I agree that the wood I have could not pull that off. I will have nice size drops that I can try on though. I think I know what you are talking about on the chambering. I am looking for pics but isnt the horn area routed out then around the upper hip area routed out also? I've seen them around before. I pretty much made up my mind to do it though.(Chamber it)

Frank I also had a question on your truss rod. I read on your post and don't quite grasp exactly what you did. (Thick headed) I know you mentioned running the TR closer to the back of the neck instead of the fretboard, but you lost me when you talked about putting a block of wood at the nut when you route it on the table. Does that mean it actually tapers from the anchor up to where it exits the headstock?
Can I run a curved TR on this one like I did my full size?

Walley,

Here is a diagram (and X-Ray) of a Chambered Reissue (left) and I believe a Gibson USA LP (right). The left hand one is the one I'm referring to...there's a reason why people, including myself, rave about these guitars.



Regarding the TR, I don't see why a curved one wouldn't work on this build. In fact, I would think that it would work better than a straight one. I only do the straight ones because they're more historically accurate, and they're easier to do.

Now, I'll try to explain how I do mine: Mine run parallel to the back (bottom) of the neck, as opposed to running parallel to the fingerboard side of the neck, as most people do. When you do it parallel to the fingerboard side, you simply put the neck blank, face down on the router table (or table saw) and run it through. If you want it parallel to the back of the neck as I do it, you have to put a little shim under the headstock end of the neck blank so that that end of the neck blank is above the surface of the machine a bit. And when you run it through your machine, the channel ends up being parallel to the back of the neck instead. I hope that's clear.


Frank

[pinefd]

Originally Posted by monsterwalley

Is this what you are referring to Frank? The top pic not the "weight relieved" pic below it.


Gibson Les Paul 101

Actually, that is not the correct chambering in a Chambered Reissue. What I posted above is correct.


Frank

[monsterwalley]

Originally Posted by pinefd

Walley,

Here is a diagram (and X-Ray) of a Chambered Reissue (left) and I believe a Gibson USA LP (right). The left hand one is the one I'm referring to...there's a reason why people, including myself, rave about these guitars.



Regarding the TR, I don't see why a curved one wouldn't work on this build. In fact, I would think that it would work better than a straight one. I only do the straight ones because they're more historically accurate, and they're easier to do.

Now, I'll try to explain how I do mine: Mine run parallel to the back (bottom) of the neck, as opposed to running parallel to the fingerboard side of the neck, as most people do. When you do it parallel to the fingerboard side, you simply put the neck blank, face down on the router table (or table saw) and run it through. If you want it parallel to the back of the neck as I do it, you have to put a little shim under the headstock end of the neck blank so that that end of the neck blank is above the surface of the machine a bit. And when you run it through your machine, the channel ends up being parallel to the back of the neck instead. I hope that's clear.


Frank

Thanks for posting pics on the chambering Frank. So the one on the left has the control and switch cavities exposed to the chamber obviously, Do you know approximately how much material they leave at the bottom of the chamber? Or in other words, how thick is the mahogany where it is chambered? You also stated that you prefer "rave" about the one on the left vs the one on the right, What is better (sorry if it's obvious) about the left one other than more material removed?

I got ya on the truss rod now. I think I will stick with the curve since I'm not going after the accuracy aspect on this one.

[landsharkey]

Originally Posted by monsterwalley

I came up with an idea for the mop on the headstock

What's yer all's opinion?



Sorry for the crappy pic, I sketched it out and just took a pic

That looks cool! I've been thinking about a "cartoonish" shark - could you sketch one? The Truth's clown inlay is one to remember.

[monsterwalley]

sharkey..... I can't take the credit for the duck fully, I printed a color version on a clipart site and altered it enough to work for the mop.

I could dig a shark up and do the same thing if you like. I'll be out of town till Saturday though.

What can I say about the truths except it's Bad a**! I've loved it ever since he posted it.

[landsharkey]

I could dig a shark up and do the same thing if you like.

That would be great - I have zero artistic ability. I dug up a few for inspiration.

[landsharkey]

One more from Shark Clip Art

[pinefd]

Originally Posted by monsterwalley

Thanks for posting pics on the chambering Frank. So the one on the left has the control and switch cavities exposed to the chamber obviously, Do you know approximately how much material they leave at the bottom of the chamber? Or in other words, how thick is the mahogany where it is chambered? You also stated that you prefer "rave" about the one on the left vs the one on the right, What is better (sorry if it's obvious) about the left one other than more material removed?

I believe both Gibson and I (if I recall correctly) leave around 1/2 inch of mahogany on the bottom (back) of the guitar, and about 1/2 to 3/4 inch around the perimeter (at the narrowest point), and hog/route out the rest. I'll see if I can find or take some pics of my octave guitar chambering in the next day or two.

The raves I hear are for the Chambered Reissues in general...nothing against the others. I believe the advantage of the CR chambering is that you have one continuous chamber for the sound to resonate throughout the whole body, as opposed to having it broken up. Another reason I hear more raves about the CR guitars, no doubt, is because they're Historics, and would/should, by default, come with higher grade materials and workmanship.


Frank

[pinefd]

I thought you might be interested in seeing this photo. It shows the chambering that's done on an actual Chambered Reissue (photo courtesy of the Chambered-Reissue.org website) Note that the perimeter of the guitar does not look like it's been cut to its final shape yet:




Frank

[monsterwalley]

Thanks a million Frank!! I just got back from Kansas city moments ago, So this is the first chance to get back to the forum since thursday morn.

I did some searching around the forum the other night and came across the answer to the bottom thickness (1/2") form a thread that was going with mr.bones? I believe it was and you reguarding a build he was doing. unfortunately the pics were deleted.

I can't wait to get started now! I need to finish up my templates first.

Another question Frank....... In your opinion should I scale the chambering to the guitar or do you think I should leave the 1/2" at the bottom, and the sides as they are full size?