Les Paul tone question

Kickstand · 12-18-2007, 01:04 PM

New guy here ready to pull the trigger on a vos r8. Really having a tough time deciding between two lp's. Played five and two of them stood out as the most toneful, best sustain, etc. Not knowing too much about the benchmark for a "good" Les Paul I'd thought I'd ask for a bit of advice. The two that I've narrowed it down to are a washed cherry burst and a beautiful iced tea burst. The cherry is 9lbs and is very loud and bright acoustically and has a good biting tone without being harsh. Plugged in it has round lows and bright highs. The iced tea is 9.5lbs and is warmer acoustically with a bit more midrange. Plugged in it is a bit thicker, smoother, and darker sounding than the cherry. The cherry plays a bit better but the iced tea is more visually appealling to me. Any thoughts?

Kickstand · 12-18-2007, 01:06 PM

Thought I would add that I have a set of wolfetone marhallheads and a vintage rs kit ready to install in whichever r8 I choose.

dwagar · 12-18-2007, 01:41 PM

very close, but, if it was me, I'd opt for the cherry. 1/2 lb lighter, and I like the bright side of it acoustically, you can always find the mids with those pickups.

LoKi · 12-18-2007, 01:47 PM

A brighter guitar can be easier to work, especially if you are a lead player and depending on the amp you're playing it with... I prefer a dark sounding Les Paul personally, but I play a style of music that darker guitars *tonewise* work well with, and I push the mids and presence on all of my amps.

Otherwise it only comes down to playability and feel and color preference. If they have the same neck profile, a good setup will make the either play like a dream.

I also have a soft spot for Ice Tea because its almost a real faded tobacco sunburst *which is my favorite finish on any instrument*. Cherry is the classic Les Paul color though.

single cut 54 · 12-18-2007, 01:50 PM

You like the sound and looks of the ''iced tea '' the only down side is it's
1/2LB heavier .I'd go for the ''iced tea'' . If it sounds good now ,how good is it gonna sound with a set of great pickups in it?Lots of vintage Lesters are in the 9 to 9 1/2 LB bracket.Looks and sound every time for me!

Stowburst · 12-18-2007, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kickstand

and a vintage rs kit ready to install in whichever r8 I choose.

Well can I have the pots and caps out the R8? There aint nothing wrong with stock 500k pots and Bumble Bees

Liam · 12-18-2007, 02:05 PM

Don't know if I'm alone, but unlike strats and teles, I find it really hard to know what a Les Paul is really going to be like until I'm in the rehearsal room with the amp cranked up. Playing on my own I like them dark, as soon as there's the rest of a band there I really like crunch and bite.

Then once you add looks into the equation like that, toss a coin. I'll bet they'll both be great. (I'd probably go with the iced tea and hope a pickup change got the bite back myself). And you'll never have to compare them again...

Kickstand · 12-18-2007, 03:11 PM

All great points, thanks! I think the washed cherry probably sounds a little better between the two but I'm more drawn to the iced tea which also has a slight hint of flame. They are both winners and once I walk out of the shop it doesn't matter anyway. I tend to use highs on my amp sparingly and push the mids a bit so I think either will sound fine. I have no idea how the wolfetones will sound. My only experience is with duncans. I guess to sum things up, the cherry is more open sounding while the ice tea sounds syrupy. The good thing is that I found two that sound great with the cherry edging the iced tea out tonally with a good amount of ring. I think either will sound much bigger than my prs cu22.

Lemonhead · 12-18-2007, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kickstand

the washed cherry probably sounds a little better between the two

And there you have it.

dwagar · 12-18-2007, 03:29 PM

I'd suggest having a quick listen to Bloomfield or Page. That little extra high end can cut the mix better than a ton of mids can.

But either way, you found 2 great guitars.

waynesmith · 12-18-2007, 05:13 PM

You should go with the one that feels and sounds the best to you. Whichever way you go, you should change the pots and wiring before the p/u's because those changes might make the burstbuckers sound better... If they don't, you can always swap out the p/u's later...Good luck and enjoy your quest, R8's are great guitars..

Axeman16 · 12-18-2007, 06:16 PM

well id go for the iced tea if it looks better because you can always get it set it up.

LoKi · 12-18-2007, 06:40 PM

'Syrupy' is more like what real 50's Les Pauls sound like.. at least the ones I've played. The Iced Tea sounds pretty dang good if you ask me. Highs can cut over a band a little better than just mids alone, but do you even plan on gigging the guitar? Also what style of music are you into? Slash is an all mids kind of player, and so is Kerry King and they don't have problems being heard over their bands.

lp59aholicDon · 12-18-2007, 06:52 PM

I'd grab what ever one really really speaks to you, Color ect is secondary if that, Playability and tone, Thats what I would be after, and I'd have to hear it cranked also thru a rig like mine

Kickstand · 12-18-2007, 07:12 PM

Definitely will be gigging with the R8. Both guitars will cut in my band. Playing everything from classic rock, 80's rock, modern rock. My main guitar right now is a prs cu22 which is very midrange heavy. Cuts through just fine.

LoKi · 12-19-2007, 12:09 AM

I think it basically will come down to color choice and weight then... They are both killer guitars by the sounds of it. What I would do is ask some random hot girls which one they think is 'sexier' and let that help sway me. Pleasin' the ladies is paramount.

Roman · 12-19-2007, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kickstand

New guy here ready to pull the trigger on a vos r8. Really having a tough time deciding between two lp's. Played five and two of them stood out as the most toneful, best sustain, etc. Not knowing too much about the benchmark for a "good" Les Paul I'd thought I'd ask for a bit of advice. The two that I've narrowed it down to are a washed cherry burst and a beautiful iced tea burst. The cherry is 9lbs and is very loud and bright acoustically and has a good biting tone without being harsh. Plugged in it has round lows and bright highs. The iced tea is 9.5lbs and is warmer acoustically with a bit more midrange. Plugged in it is a bit thicker, smoother, and darker sounding than the cherry. The cherry plays a bit better but the iced tea is more visually appealling to me. Any thoughts?

Go play them both blindfolded, let your ears and hands decide.

lp59aholicDon · 12-19-2007, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RFR

Go play them both blindfolded, let your ears and hands decide.

I rest my case behind the old Luthier Roman

Kickstand · 12-19-2007, 09:03 AM

Going this afternoon to make my final decision and end the anxiety. I'm ready to give my PRS a rest for a while. Has anyone tried the wolfetone marshallheads? Wondering how that might change the tone of the guitar.

Weldaar · 12-19-2007, 10:19 AM

Most after market pickups will change the sound of your guitar as will better caps. Those caps in stock Gibson's could be better, as can their pickups. Wolfe makes some great pickups BTW.

12-19-2007, 04:56 PM

I like the sound of the LP over 9lbs! I like how you describe the Iced Tea!

Kickstand · 12-20-2007, 12:37 PM

Went to make my decision and the cherry burst had been sold. Thought that made my decision easier but there was a tobacco that sounded great too. One more trip and I should make a purchase. I'm sure they are getting sick of me. I did notice that the iced tea had a top that was obviously not bookmatched. One side was a bit darker than the other. Is that normal? I would think that a bookmatched top would produce a more consistant tone.

dwagar · 12-20-2007, 01:37 PM

have a glance thru BOTB, you won't find many bookmatched. It's very normal. I doubt it would affect tone at all.

LoKi · 12-20-2007, 01:59 PM

Tobacco is my favorite color. I'd probably buy it, but thats just me.

Nick59 · 07-23-2008, 03:53 AM

Rather than start a new thread specifically for my question, this thread title fits the bill near enough.

One of the signs of a "good" LP is the way it sounds strummed acoustically, with vibration of the headstock and body considered important signs. Yet many guitars incorporate inertia blocks to prevent transference of the string vibration to the body (which would in effect dampen the vibration). The pickups are "reading" only the energy of the string vibrating between nut and bridge, so any transference of energy to neck and body is "lost" energy. So why, if the ideal would seem to be a design that kept the maximum vibration energy in the strings, is it that a vibrating headstock and body is a good thing for an LP? I'm puzzled and hoping someone can enlighten me....

TheWellGoodShow · 07-23-2008, 03:56 AM

go with the brigher one.

Nick59 · 07-30-2008, 03:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick59

Rather than start a new thread specifically for my question, this thread title fits the bill near enough.

One of the signs of a "good" LP is the way it sounds strummed acoustically, with vibration of the headstock and body considered important signs. Yet many guitars incorporate inertia blocks to prevent transference of the string vibration to the body (which would in effect dampen the vibration). The pickups are "reading" only the energy of the string vibrating between nut and bridge, so any transference of energy to neck and body is "lost" energy. So why, if the ideal would seem to be a design that kept the maximum vibration energy in the strings, is it that a vibrating headstock and body is a good thing for an LP? I'm puzzled and hoping someone can enlighten me....

Nobody? My puzzlement continues! In an acoustic you WANT the string vibration to transfer to the body, as it makes the wood resonate and project the sound, but an electric guitar pickup only detects string vibration, hence any vibration of the body reduces string energy and the pickup detects fewer frequencies and lower amplitudes. Or so it seems.

johnny_walker · 07-30-2008, 04:49 AM

i go for the acoustic tone. you can swap everything on the guitar but you're stuck with the wood. if it resonates well and just 'sings', i don't really care how heavy it is, what the top looks like (unless it's totally jacked) or how the electronics sound. the other thing to look at is the fretboard - you probably won't be replacing that. get the one that feels the best.

you won't be disappointed in the wolfetone marshallheads. they're great sounding pickups and really are better than the burstbuckers.

TheWellGoodShow · 07-30-2008, 04:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnny_walker

i go for the acoustic tone. you can swap everything on the guitar but you're stuck with the wood. if it resonates well and just 'sings', i don't really care how heavy it is, what the top looks like (unless it's totally jacked) or how the electronics sound. the other thing to look at is the fretboard - you probably won't be replacing that. get the one that feels the best.

you won't be disappointed in the wolfetone marshallheads. they're great sounding pickups and really are better than the burstbuckers.

I always make sure the guitar sounds good unplugged, no matter how beautiful it is, if it doesnt pass that test i put it down straight away.

mojofilter · 07-30-2008, 05:56 AM

Haste makes waste! come on now you have to decide for yourself,which one feels like you!

12-18-2007, 01:04 PM	#1 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Les Paul tone question New guy here ready to pull the trigger on a vos r8. Really having a tough time deciding between two lp's. Played five and two of them stood out as the most toneful, best sustain, etc. Not knowing too much about the benchmark for a "good" Les Paul I'd thought I'd ask for a bit of advice. The two that I've narrowed it down to are a washed cherry burst and a beautiful iced tea burst. The cherry is 9lbs and is very loud and bright acoustically and has a good biting tone without being harsh. Plugged in it has round lows and bright highs. The iced tea is 9.5lbs and is warmer acoustically with a bit more midrange. Plugged in it is a bit thicker, smoother, and darker sounding than the cherry. The cherry plays a bit better but the iced tea is more visually appealling to me. Any thoughts?

12-18-2007, 01:06 PM	#2 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Thought I would add that I have a set of wolfetone marhallheads and a vintage rs kit ready to install in whichever r8 I choose.

12-18-2007, 01:41 PM	#3 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 7,567 Thanks: 93 Thanked 137 Times in 17 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question very close, but, if it was me, I'd opt for the cherry. 1/2 lb lighter, and I like the bright side of it acoustically, you can always find the mids with those pickups.

12-18-2007, 01:47 PM	#4 (permalink)
LoKi V.I.P. Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Calgary, Alberta Posts: 6,243 Thanks: 145 Thanked 39 Times in 14 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question A brighter guitar can be easier to work, especially if you are a lead player and depending on the amp you're playing it with... I prefer a dark sounding Les Paul personally, but I play a style of music that darker guitars tonewise work well with, and I push the mids and presence on all of my amps. Otherwise it only comes down to playability and feel and color preference. If they have the same neck profile, a good setup will make the either play like a dream. I also have a soft spot for Ice Tea because its almost a real faded tobacco sunburst which is my favorite finish on any instrument. Cherry is the classic Les Paul color though.

12-18-2007, 01:50 PM	#5 (permalink)
single cut 54 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Field of Mud Posts: 2,146 Thanks: 178 Thanked 36 Times in 8 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question You like the sound and looks of the ''iced tea '' the only down side is it's 1/2LB heavier .I'd go for the ''iced tea'' . If it sounds good now ,how good is it gonna sound with a set of great pickups in it?Lots of vintage Lesters are in the 9 to 9 1/2 LB bracket.Looks and sound every time for me!

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12-18-2007, 02:05 PM	#7 (permalink)
Liam V.I.P. Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Preston, Lancashire, United Kingdom Posts: 5,183 Thanks: 87 Thanked 105 Times in 24 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Don't know if I'm alone, but unlike strats and teles, I find it really hard to know what a Les Paul is really going to be like until I'm in the rehearsal room with the amp cranked up. Playing on my own I like them dark, as soon as there's the rest of a band there I really like crunch and bite. Then once you add looks into the equation like that, toss a coin. I'll bet they'll both be great. (I'd probably go with the iced tea and hope a pickup change got the bite back myself). And you'll never have to compare them again...

12-18-2007, 03:11 PM	#8 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question All great points, thanks! I think the washed cherry probably sounds a little better between the two but I'm more drawn to the iced tea which also has a slight hint of flame. They are both winners and once I walk out of the shop it doesn't matter anyway. I tend to use highs on my amp sparingly and push the mids a bit so I think either will sound fine. I have no idea how the wolfetones will sound. My only experience is with duncans. I guess to sum things up, the cherry is more open sounding while the ice tea sounds syrupy. The good thing is that I found two that sound great with the cherry edging the iced tea out tonally with a good amount of ring. I think either will sound much bigger than my prs cu22.

12-18-2007, 03:29 PM	#10 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 7,567 Thanks: 93 Thanked 137 Times in 17 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question I'd suggest having a quick listen to Bloomfield or Page. That little extra high end can cut the mix better than a ton of mids can. But either way, you found 2 great guitars.

12-18-2007, 05:13 PM	#11 (permalink)
waynesmith Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: New York Posts: 328 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question You should go with the one that feels and sounds the best to you. Whichever way you go, you should change the pots and wiring before the p/u's because those changes might make the burstbuckers sound better... If they don't, you can always swap out the p/u's later...Good luck and enjoy your quest, R8's are great guitars..

12-18-2007, 06:16 PM	#12 (permalink)
Axeman16 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 2,079 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question well id go for the iced tea if it looks better because you can always get it set it up.

12-18-2007, 06:40 PM	#13 (permalink)
LoKi V.I.P. Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Calgary, Alberta Posts: 6,243 Thanks: 145 Thanked 39 Times in 14 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question 'Syrupy' is more like what real 50's Les Pauls sound like.. at least the ones I've played. The Iced Tea sounds pretty dang good if you ask me. Highs can cut over a band a little better than just mids alone, but do you even plan on gigging the guitar? Also what style of music are you into? Slash is an all mids kind of player, and so is Kerry King and they don't have problems being heard over their bands.

12-18-2007, 06:52 PM	#14 (permalink)
lp59aholicDon V.I.P. Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: North Carolina in the Mountains Posts: 5,219 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question I'd grab what ever one really really speaks to you, Color ect is secondary if that, Playability and tone, Thats what I would be after, and I'd have to hear it cranked also thru a rig like mine __________________ I am a sheepdog, Its not just a vocation, its my nature Live with it, Lead, Follow, or get the hell outta my way . Tis better to have the sword and live by it, than to reach in need and find the scabboard empty .Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on whats for dinner- Ben Franklin Don't be talkin' the talk if you can't walk the walk

12-18-2007, 07:12 PM	#15 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Definitely will be gigging with the R8. Both guitars will cut in my band. Playing everything from classic rock, 80's rock, modern rock. My main guitar right now is a prs cu22 which is very midrange heavy. Cuts through just fine.

12-19-2007, 12:09 AM	#16 (permalink)
LoKi V.I.P. Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Calgary, Alberta Posts: 6,243 Thanks: 145 Thanked 39 Times in 14 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question I think it basically will come down to color choice and weight then... They are both killer guitars by the sounds of it. What I would do is ask some random hot girls which one they think is 'sexier' and let that help sway me. Pleasin' the ladies is paramount.

12-19-2007, 09:03 AM	#19 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Going this afternoon to make my final decision and end the anxiety. I'm ready to give my PRS a rest for a while. Has anyone tried the wolfetone marshallheads? Wondering how that might change the tone of the guitar.

12-19-2007, 10:19 AM	#20 (permalink)
Weldaar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: NJ Posts: 1,559 Thanks: 1 Thanked 8 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Most after market pickups will change the sound of your guitar as will better caps. Those caps in stock Gibson's could be better, as can their pickups. Wolfe makes some great pickups BTW. __________________ *Trust in Christ*

12-19-2007, 04:56 PM	#21 (permalink)
SKATTERBRANE Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Les Paul tone question I like the sound of the LP over 9lbs! I like how you describe the Iced Tea!

12-20-2007, 12:37 PM	#22 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Went to make my decision and the cherry burst had been sold. Thought that made my decision easier but there was a tobacco that sounded great too. One more trip and I should make a purchase. I'm sure they are getting sick of me. I did notice that the iced tea had a top that was obviously not bookmatched. One side was a bit darker than the other. Is that normal? I would think that a bookmatched top would produce a more consistant tone.

12-20-2007, 01:37 PM	#23 (permalink)
dwagar V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: C eh? N eh? D eh? Posts: 7,567 Thanks: 93 Thanked 137 Times in 17 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question have a glance thru BOTB, you won't find many bookmatched. It's very normal. I doubt it would affect tone at all.

12-20-2007, 01:59 PM	#24 (permalink)
LoKi V.I.P. Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Calgary, Alberta Posts: 6,243 Thanks: 145 Thanked 39 Times in 14 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Tobacco is my favorite color. I'd probably buy it, but thats just me.

07-23-2008, 03:53 AM	#25 (permalink)
Nick59 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Australia Posts: 217 Thanks: 0 Thanked 39 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Rather than start a new thread specifically for my question, this thread title fits the bill near enough. One of the signs of a "good" LP is the way it sounds strummed acoustically, with vibration of the headstock and body considered important signs. Yet many guitars incorporate inertia blocks to prevent transference of the string vibration to the body (which would in effect dampen the vibration). The pickups are "reading" only the energy of the string vibrating between nut and bridge, so any transference of energy to neck and body is "lost" energy. So why, if the ideal would seem to be a design that kept the maximum vibration energy in the strings, is it that a vibrating headstock and body is a good thing for an LP? I'm puzzled and hoping someone can enlighten me....

07-23-2008, 03:56 AM	#26 (permalink)
TheWellGoodShow V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: the south Posts: 3,135 Thanks: 55 Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question go with the brigher one. __________________ "Now Known as The Post-O-Matic 5000" ZOMG! Its Gemma!!

07-30-2008, 04:49 AM	#28 (permalink)
johnny_walker Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 38 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Les Paul tone question i go for the acoustic tone. you can swap everything on the guitar but you're stuck with the wood. if it resonates well and just 'sings', i don't really care how heavy it is, what the top looks like (unless it's totally jacked) or how the electronics sound. the other thing to look at is the fretboard - you probably won't be replacing that. get the one that feels the best. you won't be disappointed in the wolfetone marshallheads. they're great sounding pickups and really are better than the burstbuckers.

07-30-2008, 05:56 AM	#30 (permalink)
mojofilter Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cairo/N.Y. Posts: 1,285 Thanks: 0 Thanked 10 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Les Paul tone question Haste makes waste! come on now you have to decide for yourself,which one feels like you!

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