Recommend a Refinish Shop, and How much will it cost? I did a search...

[SoWhat?]

Ok, I have searched, and I am not able to find the info I am looking for. I have seen the refinish thread:

Historic refinish/ aging help needed

Which mentions HMO and RS, but apparently I need more info to google them. Also, I visited:

Guitar Finishing

But there are no prices, and I wouldn't know who is most reputable anyway.

I am considering buying a 1960 Plain Top G0 with a Lemon Burst top and a few dings in the top. I think I can get a deal on it, and would love to have it refinished. I don't like Lemon Burst tops, so I was thinking about a Bourbon Burst. I don't think the rest of the guitar will need a refin. and I don't anticipate hardware changes. Just a top refinish.

Who should I consider?

How long does it typically take?

How much should it cost?

I have never considered anything like this before, so I am clueless.

If I have missed an obvious thread answering these question, please kindly point me in the right direction.

Thanks.

[442 SLASH]

Look up Historic Makeovers

[buckwild]

I've had fantastic service using RS guitarworks. HM looks great and Kim is awesome to work with. I'm having Ian Anderson refinish a guitar of mine right now. He does some fine work too.

[SoWhat?]

Originally Posted by buckwild

I've had fantastic service using RS guitarworks. HM looks great and Kim is awesome to work with. I'm having Ian Anderson refinish a guitar of mine right now. He does some fine work too.

What is HM and how much does it cost?

[nicolasrivera]

Originally Posted by sowhat?

what is hm and how much does it cost?

do a web search...all you want to know is there....:d

[lkft]

See for yourself...
Historic Makeover Guitar Packages and Pricing

[SoWhat?]

Originally Posted by nicolasrivera

do a web search...all you want to know is there....:d

Yeah, I get that. Anyone can google this.

I want to know who people like you would recommend, because you have used them. Or others on MLP have used them.

[Sct13]

Historic Makeovers, I am having one done by Kim right now and thus far the results are not in because its not finished yet. However Kim is dedicated to your satisfaction and his knowledge base of vintage guitars (especially LP's from 52-60) is very in-depth. Highly recommended. Their attention to small details and his attentiveness to what you want out of your refin/makeover is the attraction for me.

He also provides a photographic record of their progress step by step. You can almost watch the transformation. Updates are regular.

I can tell you I did it because I will probably never be able to afford the perfect vintage burst. This is the next closest thing. Shoot him an email and communicate with him

[fairlanericky]

Here's a guy in Vancouver, B.C.

GM VINTAGE RESTORATIONS - The finest vintage guitar restorations, paint jobs, and related servivces


Ric

[nicolasrivera]

Originally Posted by SoWhat?

Yeah, I get that. Anyone can google this.

I want to know who people like you would recommend, because you have used them. Or others on MLP have used them.

If you want perfectly done and rather fast...Historic Makeover
If you want it well done and less the 1K.........Davenport
And i won't mention the other guy because that can take up to 4 years to be completed..

[lkft]

The top carve and other reshaping procedures done by makeovers worries me a little bit. I mean, doesn't Gibson say that they accurately and painstakingly measure original bursts and recreate these in their Historic line? If a makeover takes a top that has already been accurately reproduced and takes even more off of it then wouldn't it be at that point less accurate? I would be afraid that it would be too flat and not enough belly.

Now if someone wanted a little meat taken off the neck b/c it was too chunky then that I would understand. But I don't think I would want the top recarved.

[SoWhat?]

Yes, I have to admit to being ignorant and nieve to the whole Historic Reproduction Guitar quest. I have some Gibson Custom Shop Historic reissue guitars, which I assumed were fairly close to the original. Now, I see that there is an entire industry dedicated to taking those "inaccurate" guitars and making them "accurate" !?!?

I guess I shouldn't be surprised Gibson doesn't get them exactly right.

But my original question was really only about refinishing the top, because I don't like the color and would like a high quality refinish to get the color I want. I am glad to know there is much more that can be done to make a guitar, as accurate as, one actually made in 1960, but it is really more than I was looking for.

[nicolasrivera]

Originally Posted by lkft

The top carve and other reshaping procedures done by makeovers worries me a little bit. I mean, doesn't Gibson say that they accurately and painstakingly measure original bursts

BUEN CHISTE!!!!!

[Big John]

Originally Posted by SoWhat?

...I am considering buying a 1960 Plain Top G0 with a Lemon Burst top and a few dings in the top. I think I can get a deal on it, and would love to have it refinished. I don't like Lemon Burst tops, so I was thinking about a Bourbon Burst. I don't think the rest of the guitar will need a refin. and I don't anticipate hardware changes. Just a top refinish...

According to HM's website, it appears as though a simple top refin is not available. You might want to contact Kim and ask if he'd be willing to do that.


Side Question: what's up with Amazon/Cocobolo fingerboards?
How is that more vintage correct?
Did he run out of Brazilian?

[pinefd]

Originally Posted by Big John

Side Question: what's up with Amazon/Cocobolo fingerboards?
How is that more vintage correct?
Did he run out of Brazilian?

Wow, John, I hadn't noticed that before. That's interesting. I wonder if it's a Lacey Act thing. I know that I'm now getting away from using BRW on my builds because of this, especially because of all the potential international business I expect, and the fear of shipping BRW outside our borders.


Frank

[lkft]

Originally Posted by SoWhat?

Yes, I have to admit to being ignorant and nieve to the whole Historic Reproduction Guitar quest. I have some Gibson Custom Shop Historic reissue guitars, which I assumed were fairly close to the original. Now, I see that there is an entire industry dedicated to taking those "inaccurate" guitars and making them "accurate" !?!?

I guess I shouldn't be surprised Gibson doesn't get them exactly right.

But my original question was really only about refinishing the top, because I don't like the color and would like a high quality refinish to get the color I want. I am glad to know there is much more that can be done to make a guitar, as accurate as, one actually made in 1960, but it is really more than I was looking for.

Well I say if you like the guitar and have played it and connected with it then I'd buy it before someone else does. The finish is secondary to me. Granted I want a guitar that pleases me aesthetically but which would you rather have, a guitar that you like the finish on but does nothing for you musically or vice versa?

I have only one Gibson, a 2010 R9 lemon burst. I picked it from a wall of about twenty other Historics and this one was the the best of them all b/c I played them all. I wasn't particularly drawn to the finish as much as I was to the tone. That's what made it a must-have for me. It still inspires me musically, and makes me a better player b/c of it. I really don't see myself getting another LP b/c I'm not sure it would get played with the other one around.

[Sct13]

That's just it the top carve is more standardized from Gibson, he has a couple of real bursts that he keeps as reference guitars and copies the top carve from them. He said that some don't really need much wood taken off, others are way off and need more but its not that much, just enough to bring it to the shape that was common, it depends. Also bursts from the 50's were all different anyway there is no one way that is absolute (I mean shape). Also Roayalite binding is a few mm wider enhancing the outline which is more historicaly correct, and nicer.

the neck reset does away with the rubber cement Gibson uses to glue the neck down, suspected tone loss here and glued with period correct glue. The truss rod is replaced with period correct hardware, Also since the old rose wood is striped off, new Brazilian wood is used to to bring it up a historical notch (a large notch in my book). The neck is reshaped at the binding for the proper shape of the time period as well, There is much much more, it not just aging and refin.

So much depends on the level of accuracy you desire. Do you want Concourse D' Elegance or a Refin . (I don't mean to knock other re-finishers out there by any means) And your budget.

It won't hurt to contact any of the refin guys out there and ask a million questions. Most importantly ask yourself what you want. I went round and round been through around 30 guitars and still want a burst, but I am not selling the house or the kids college fund for a guitar.

Drop Kim an Email and he will get back with you, very knowledgeable, personable and above all else honest.

[slapshot]

MJT Custom Aged Guitar Finishes, Custom Orders

[nicolasrivera]

Anything fender that comes out of them is to die for!!!

But i have wondered, why they never showed a Les Paul refinish!!, even on their website they don't mention any les paul refinish. Would be awesome to see work of them on a LP, i bet it will be as amazing as their starts and teles.

Originally Posted by slapshot

MJT Custom Aged Guitar Finishes, Custom Orders

[Big John]

Originally Posted by pinefd

Wow, John, I hadn't noticed that before. That's interesting. I wonder if it's a Lacey Act thing...

It's not a Lacey issue if you source the wood within the states, from dealers/manufacturers who either have old stock (grand-fathered in) or have the paperwork to cover new stock. Personally, if I had a stock pile of Brazilian right now, it wouldn't see the light of day until I retire.

Originally Posted by Sct13

...he has a couple of real bursts that he keeps as reference guitars and copies the top carve from them...

Really? Kim has a half-million dollars worth guitars laying around for copying the top carves? Did not know that.

Originally Posted by Sct13

...rubber cement Gibson uses to glue the neck down...

Just because Titebond cures with a matrix (RF, UV, and Catalyst cure) instead of a crystaline structure like hide glue does not mean it's rubber.

Originally Posted by Sct13

...since the old rose wood is striped off, new Brazilian wood is used to to bring it up a historical notch (a large notch in my book)...

You might want to check on that. It appears as though Brazilian is no longer the HM standard; it's a $750 upgrade.

[slapshot]

also given you're just after a colour change (correct?) which is quite understandable have you ever thought about doing this yourself?
wetsand the top back some spray down some cherry or whatever colour then clear and well .... there ya go.
might cost ya say $50 or so in materials but the experience and reward will be priceless.
and of course if you totally **** it up pay someone to do it like you originally planned.
I'm a big advocate of DIY and this isn't an overly complex task

[delawaregold]

Originally Posted by pinefd

I know that I'm now getting away from using BRW on my builds because
of this, especially because of all the potential international business I expect,
and the fear of shipping BRW outside our borders.

That should not be a problem, Frank. As long as you supply the Pre-Ban Certification,
and the Chain of Custody Documentation so the new owner has the documentation to
apply for a permit.
It is a fairly simple procedure, “IF” you have those documents.

http://www.fws.gov/forms/3-200-3.pdf

[nicolasrivera]

Originally Posted by slapshot

I'm a big advocate of DIY and this isn't an overly complex task

Amen for that!

[Sct13]

I am not a chemist, I am going by what I learned here on this and other forums, and other research. Maybe the the wording on my part was extreme, my apologies. To make it more clear, my understanding is that the glue gibson uses does not provide as good wood to wood bond than hot hide glue. I am no expert in guitar building, still learning.

The Brazilian up charge is new, however my guitar has been over there more than a month, and via telephone conversations with Kim I am getting the Braz for the price previously agreed, maybe I am one of the last. I was unaware of this change. BTW Cocobolo has been reported to be used by Gibson. This is unverifiable by me.

I can see why there is a charge, I just watched brazilian billets go for quite a bit on ebay tonight. They were large pieces however.

[pinefd]

Originally Posted by delawaregold

That should not be a problem, Frank. As long as you supply the Pre-Ban Certification,
and the Chain of Custody Documentation so the new owner has the documentation to
apply for a permit.
It is a fairly simple procedure, “IF” you have those documents.

http://www.fws.gov/forms/3-200-3.pdf

Well, Artie, considering I bought all my BRW long before I, or any of my suppliers had ever heard of the Lacey Act, it's a real problem. That said, I'll probably continue to use the BRW I have for some domestic custom orders only.


Oh, and to the OP, if you're looking for a top refin only, I'd probably suggest RS, or NTL (a former Gibson Custom Shop guy): NTL Guitar - Home



Frank

[BillB1960]

Originally Posted by nicolasrivera

If you want perfectly done and rather fast...Historic Makeover
If you want it well done and less the 1K.........Davenport
And i won't mention the other guy because that can take up to 4 years to be completed..

Tell us again Nicky...how many guitars have you had refinished at HM?

[guitarnut_germany]

Originally Posted by Sct13

Historic Makeovers, I am having one done by Kim right now and thus far the results are not in because its not finished yet. However Kim is dedicated to your satisfaction and his knowledge base of vintage guitars (especially LP's from 52-60) is very in-depth. Highly recommended. Their attention to small details and his attentiveness to what you want out of your refin/makeover is the attraction for me.

He also provides a photographic record of their progress step by step. You can almost watch the transformation. Updates are regular.

I can tell you I did it because I will probably never be able to afford the perfect vintage burst. This is the next closest thing. Shoot him an email and communicate with him

I think the next closest thing to a burst would be a replica made by Tom Bartlett (or possibly another good luthier) using old growth woods.......... it doesn't get better than this IMO.

It's pricy, but A LOT cheaper than an old burst.

I would prefer this to any "makeover" job, if I wanted the "real deal".

And BTW, the color on a guitar has never really been a deal breaker for me (unless it's a sparkle finish or black on an non custom LP which I don't like )

[slapshot]

Originally Posted by BillB1960

Tell us again Nicky...how many guitars have you had refinished at HM?

more importantly how many have you done yourself?

[nicolasrivera]

Originally Posted by slapshot

more importantly how many have you done yourself?

About 18! Not all les pauls and I have posted a few of my refinish jobs here as well...do a search

[nicolasrivera]

Originally Posted by BillB1960

Tell us again Nicky...how many guitars have you had refinished at HM?

Behave Billyboy!