Am I going to have to retrain myself after over 45 years of playing guitar ?

[Steven]

Figured I'd say "screw my pride" and ask a rudimentary question regarding something I developed over the years-



Small thing I never noticed, never paid attention to but perhaps it is incorrect. When I hold the pick, I hold the top 50% roughly with my thumb, and the bottom with my index AND middle finger, sometimes holding the tip at about a 45 degree angle towards the bridge, other times just holding the pick tip perpendicular to the strings; gripping more of course if I want pinched harmonics etc. I've heard you are only supposed to use the index finger for gripping the underside of the pick (either straight or at a 90 degree bend) but is holding the pick underside with two fingers impeding anything such as speed ? Accuracy ? Something I just do, and never paid attention to it. Should I break the habit of having the index and center finger together ? Strange question from a veteran guitarist, however I'm not too proud to do things correctly assuming I am not I never asked anybody how to hold a pick, I just started on my own, (but recently saw an instructional video that stated just thumb and index finger should grip pick).

[Gangsta_rick]

Is it working for you?
I think I hold a pick the "wrong" way but it works for me so why bother changing?

[AngryHatter]

My guitar teacher told me to emulate the small things like the way you hold the pick of those you want to sound like.
The 'whys' come later.

So I started holding the pick the way McLaughlin does. Thumb and forefinger with the middle finger sticking out...like a fulcrum. I'd walk around the house just gripping a pick. (And unknowingly giving everyone the finger)

So I found it made my hand "feel" more balanced. Two fingers at the pick, two curled up and outside like a counterweight and one jutting out into space. I also noticed I could play with my hand anchored, on the bridge, or freefloating.


Habits are mental barriers - muscle memory is fast to train.

[Steven]

Originally Posted by Gangsta_rick

Is it working for you?
I think I hold a pick the "wrong" way but it works for me so why bother changing?

Because improper technique has drawbacks. What appears to be working, might be impeding certain progress.

[X–Ray]

__________________

IIRC, EVH holds his pick this way

If it works for both of you, why fix it?



(correction welcomed regarding EVH)

[James_lynn]

I changed the way I hold the pick 2 times.
1st was when someone told me I was holding it with 3 fingers(like you and Steve Morse,and didn't know about Morse that time)
2nd when I had to change from sitting from the fingerprint of my index(Hendrix) ,to the top of it.(mostly for metal music)
I just want you to know that if you decide to change it,it will affect your tone and it will be more than 2 months till it gets natural to the new change.
First change was after 3 years and second after 7 since I started..
If you feel the way your holding it negatively affects your picking you should change it,otherwise not.

[mdubya]

If what you are doing impedes you, I would go for a change. If it works for you, I wouldn't worry about it.

[huw]

I think that your picking hand should not have a single way of doing things, it should be more fluid, and able to adjust to whatever you are playing at the time. I'm pretty certain that if you were to film my picking hand whilst I played for a while you would see a number of different hand/pick positions. Chances are that I wouldn't be conscious of the changes either - I'd just be playing.

I don't think that there is one "best" way to hold your pick. Each way of holding it is good for some things and not so good for others. Try a few different grips - definitely including fingerstyle, and pick & fingers - and let yourself absorb what is easy, or not, with each. Before too long you will find yourself adjusting on the go.

The worst thing that one can do IMHO is to stick rigidly to the idea that "I need to hold the pick like this all the time". I know that some people do that (some very good players amongst them, some very famous ones too) but it's not what I'd advise.

But above all, go with what works for you (just don't expect the same thing to work all the time )

YMMV etc

[Steven]

Yes huw, I do change my pick holding pattern and wasn't aware of it. I also hold the pick with two fingers with as much ease. I suppose I just caught myself holding the pick with three fingers last night. or a third finger resting on the pick (never gave it a second thought) and wanted to question whether or not this was a bad practice.

[Gyroman]

I have a tendency to hold my pick that way too. The only time I've noticed it to be an impediment is when using the pick and finger technique, i.e. using the pick to pluck one string and finger to pluck another string simultaneously.

[JonR]

I've been holding the pick much the same way as you, for about the same length of time. Nobody ever showed me, it just felt normal.
I hold it between tips of thumb, middle and index. Mostly between thumb and middle, with index supporting the front edge. Much like I hold a pen.
I have sometimes tried what is supposedly the "correct" way - as in mdubya's pics - and my feeling was:
1. Wow, it feels a bit stiff and rigid - not much manoeuvrability;
2. Wow, my knuckles are a bit close to the strings; I wouldn't want to strum with this grip;
3. Hmm, I can sense if I stuck with this I'd be able to play scales and melodies a lot faster. The hand movement required for alternate picking is much smaller than with my grip.

IOW - even without practising with this grip - I can feel advantages, but also clear disadvantages. I play lead guitar, but always combined with chord playing, and it just feels too clumsy and stiff for chord playing. I can't get the variety of attack and articulation I get with mine.
Of course (I guess) that must be simply down to not being used to it. After all, it works for plenty of other people!

But I'm not about to retrain myself now! And I did find a while back that Pat Metheny uses the same grip as me, so I figure if it's good enough for him...

(Yes, that's him, not me, btw )

Naturally using up thumb and 2 fingers makes hybrid picking much harder, but if I want that sound I just drop the pick (or palm it) and play fingerstyle (which gives me one more finger to play with than hybrid picking does).

[LiveSimply]

I too was never shown the "proper" way. I hold it like the OP and JonR, except I only use the underside of my index finger as support and not the middle and index. Like JonR, I, at one point, was exposed to the grip shown in the pictures and recall that it felt very rigid, especially when strumming chords on my acoustic. I didn't seem to have the ability to play with the dynamics as much with that grip, but it may just be a matter of getting accustomed to it. I think my method also frees me up a bit more to do hybrid picking vs the OPs/Jon's grip. However, I assume the disadvantage of my grip is that I may lose the pick a bit easier than you guys. I never felt it hindered my technique (speed, flexibility, etc) in any way, but can see how the more traditional way can aid in the speed department. As it is I'm not breaking any speed limits any time soon, nor do I think I care to, so it may be a moot point for me.

[*K*]

I found adjusting my grip from how the OP describes to just thumb and index finger made me carry less tension in my forearm and resulted in a faster, more fluid and more versatile picking style. This didn't happen overnight though as I had a few years in before I made the adjustment and it took a while for me to relax properly into the 'new' grip.
I think you need to find something that works for you though, like huw said there's not one best way to hold the pick. Different grips, angles of attack and even which side of the pick you use will produce different sounds so experiment, keep what works, discard what doesn't.

[Lungo]

Make a change if you feel your technique is holding you back. After 27 years of playing a certain way I decided I needed to make a change and I'm glad I did. I'm seeing results and the "old" way I was doing things is so uncomfortable and foreign now I can't imagine going back. It only took a few nights of concentrated practice with nothing but picking exercises and I was pretty much good to go.

[Fudaa]

I think the crux of this discussion hinges on a persons strumming technique. Ive noticed through my 20 years plus of playing that people strum in basically two different ways.

1) Using their elbow as a fulcrum or
2) Using their wrist as a fulcrum

Most people who use their elbow will hold the pick in the "standard" position - like the pictures above. Whereas most people who strum from the wrist will use the "thumb/index" technique. (of course there are exceptions to this - but in my experience they are few and far between.)

I strum from the wrist (which Ive been told is "wrong" too!) and hold the pick "thumb/index. Sometimes I run across a person at a jam or just around that has defficulty following my strumming pattern or vice versa. Without fail Ive found that the other person is strumming from the wrist. If I switch to elbow strumming when playing with that person - WA LAAAA - problem solved. I play mostly lead but do alot of funky rhthym comping in the verses and it just "feels more right" to hold the pick the way I do, but if I switch and strumm from the elbow (when playing chords esp.) I find it is harder to hold on to the pick.

Anyone else ever had a similar observation?

[AngryHatter]

Originally Posted by Fudaa

I think the crux of this discussion hinges on a persons strumming technique. Ive noticed through my 20 years plus of playing that people strum in basically two different ways.

1) Using their elbow as a fulcrum or
2) Using their wrist as a fulcrum

Most people who use their elbow will hold the pick in the "standard" position - like the pictures above. Whereas most people who strum from the wrist will use the "thumb/index" technique. (of course there are exceptions to this - but in my experience they are few and far between.)

I strum from the wrist (which Ive been told is "wrong" too!) and hold the pick "thumb/index. Sometimes I run across a person at a jam or just around that has defficulty following my strumming pattern or vice versa. Without fail Ive found that the other person is strumming from the wrist. If I switch to elbow strumming when playing with that person - WA LAAAA - problem solved. I play mostly lead but do alot of funky rhthym comping in the verses and it just "feels more right" to hold the pick the way I do, but if I switch and strumm from the elbow (when playing chords esp.) I find it is harder to hold on to the pick.

Anyone else ever had a similar observation?

Elbow is for speed, wrist is for most everything else. I use both. Alternate picking unless piece calls for something else.

[MostEd]

Originally Posted by X–Ray

__________________

IIRC, EVH holds his pick this way

If it works for both of you, why fix it?



(correction welcomed regarding EVH)

Doesn't Ed hold it with Thumb and Middle finger? And tapping with the Index?
That's how I do it, naturally(I never knew it was like Ed until one of my friends told me, even tho EVH is my hero, how could I not know about that)

[cosunrise]

I think there are 2 factors that contribute to picking from the wrist - up-down (between ulna and radius bones) and swiveling/twisting your forearm. That said, a lot of people seems to use a combination of the two types of movement.

It seems to me that the up-down with no/little swivel is tough on your wrist joint and is a lot of stress. I remember seeing a guy play a bunch of hi-speed stuff like this and shaking his wrist out during breaks in runs.

In regards to the original question, I agree with only changing if its holding you back from something or causing injury. I remember reading years ago about Paul Gilbert changing his picking technique because it was causing some injury.

[splatter]

Originally Posted by Steven

Because improper technique has drawbacks. What appears to be working, might be impeding certain progress.

mights grow on a chickens ass .
actually mites grow on a chickens ass but you know what I'm saying . Anyway , Jeff Healey played the guitar laying on his lap . his "improper technique " didn't hold him back . Also what is "proper technique " anyway ? Its some professors opinion on how you should do things . Most opinions grow the same place mites do .

[Angus]

Originally Posted by Steven

and wanted to question whether or not this was a bad practice.

Hi Steven, respect for your 45 years playing and also for asking the question.

I would only question the bad practice/technique point. What is bad practice? If its something that can damage your hands, or clearly impairs your ability to perform a technique then that ticks the bad practice box for me, but outside that... I'm a believer in there being many entrances into the temple, and most of us find certain ones suit us better than others.

I have something of a trust issue with people saying "This (my way) is the right way". I think our own little foibles and homegrown methods are what give us our personality, but having said that, its always worth experimenting with a new approach to see if it can take you a little further to where you want to go.

[kfowler8]

I've retrained my picking grip several times over the past 20+ years of playing. It's always been because I discovered my prior technique was limiting what I was trying to learn. It took a little while but not too long to get used to.

IMO, it all depends on the style you play. If you're playing slow blues, you probably have more leeway. If you're playing shred or even jazz, you may want to look at what allows you to pick more efficiently and accurately.

[paulgibson]

If you use 4 fingers and can play some good guitar then hell, it doesn't matter how you hold it. I've been playing for over 40 years myself and I attack the strings with the top part of the pick as opposed to the pointed bottom.


Posted from Mylespaul.com App for Android

[colchar]

Originally Posted by X–Ray

__________________

IIRC, EVH holds his pick this way

If it works for both of you, why fix it?



(correction welcomed regarding EVH)

I believe Steve Morse does as well.

[colchar]

Originally Posted by paulgibson

If you use 4 fingers and can play some good guitar then hell, it doesn't matter how you hold it. I've been playing for over 40 years myself and I attack the strings with the top part of the pick as opposed to the pointed bottom.


Posted from Mylespaul.com App for Android

SRV did that as well.

[colchar]

Forum brother Mal has a video that addresses how to hold the pick (and several other things) that might be of interest to the OP:

Brother Can You Paradigm? (picking and posture) - YouTube

Brother Can You Paradigm? (picking and posture) - YouTube

Here is another video that addresses how to hold a pick (I interpret this to be similar to Mal's "picking salt" analogy):

How to Hold a Guitar Pick - YouTube

How to Hold a Guitar Pick - YouTube

[Lungo]

This is how I held the pick going back as far as I can remember:





Shawn Lane held the pick "backwards" like that and if you've seen any vids of that guy you know it didn't hold him back. I thought if it works for him it's good enough for me. But I realized it was hindering me so I changed my technique and rotated the pick clockwise in my grip to the conventional way of picking:




My playing has improved considerably over the last few months and I'm glad I was open minded enough to try something different. I'm not saying there's a right or wrong way, but if someone feels their technique is hindering their progress they should be confident enough to try something different. You don't have to copy your guitar heros to learn from them.

[Cyclave]

Originally Posted by MostEd

Doesn't Ed hold it with Thumb and Middle finger? And tapping with the Index?
That's how I do it, naturally(I never knew it was like Ed until one of my friends told me, even tho EVH is my hero, how could I not know about that)

You are correct as far as I know. He learned to hold it that way so he could maintain control of the pick 100% of the time even while tapping. I tried playing this way and just didn't like it. It is really helpful for fast transitions between tapping and strumming parts imo.

[colchar]

I keep trying different ways of holding the pick but can never settle on one method that is as comfortable for picking as it is for strumming. I need to try Mal's way and the way shown in that other video I posted. I have always been told that was 'wrong' but think it might help me a bit.

[Malikon]

Originally Posted by colchar

I keep trying different ways of holding the pick but can never settle on one method that is as comfortable for picking as it is for strumming. I need to try Mal's way and the way shown in that other video I posted. I have always been told that was 'wrong' but think it might help me a bit.

there really isn't one.

When picking, or trem picking, strumming, rock-hacking,...while you may be holding the pick a similar way your right hand is very different with how it's approaching the strings.

Took me a long time to learn to strum and do like funky "chuka-chuka" type stuff because I was so used to keeping a rigid control on my pick and hand I had to learn to 'loosen up' and learn how to just let my hand swing.

Sometimes it almost feels like I'm letting the weight of the right hand swing it back and forth like a pendulum.

[colchar]

Originally Posted by Malikon

Took me a long time to learn to strum and do like funky "chuka-chuka" type stuff because I was so used to keeping a rigid control on my pick and hand I had to learn to 'loosen up' and learn how to just let my hand swing.

I have similar issues.