MUSIC THEORY 101 Don't Be Afraid :)

[Big_dawg]

Originally Posted by hugo6969

I'm beginning to think that I'm too stupid for theory. Nobody else seems to be struggling with this. Maybe being 49 is too old for this stuff?? It's enough to make you wanna give up for crying out loud. I've bought so many books and I don't seem to be much further ahead then knowing all the notes on the fretboard, the major scale (cause that's a toughie, she says making fun of herself) and the modes and the notes in each mode but not where the sharps or flats are. So, as you can see, I'm at a freakin kindergarden level!
I appreciate the help but it's wasted on me. But thanks Jonesy, you're sweet for trying and for all the people you have helped. Shows your character and you do it out of the goodness of your heart.

Everyone struggles with this to start with youre definately not alone in that... Where theory's concerned Im an absolute beginner, but sometimes you see stuff that makes sense and ties together and you think oh thats what they meant. If you know any pianists or keyboard players get them to show you intervals on a keyboard it'll suddenly seem so clear you'll wonder why everyone just doesnt show you a picture of a keyboard and then a guitar neck and show the realtion between the 2.

I remember opening a theory book saw lots about intervals, 1/4 steps, 1/2 steps and lots of other bits I instantly forgot and dont think Ive picked it up since!.

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by GNR4EVR

Hey, Jonesy, great posts. Since I just got to this and am going to go through it thoroughly, I can only say from my experience, only having a few semesters way way back in High school and no other lessons since, that I welcome a easier way of going through the scales. After all that time, I lost interest (for various reasons) and didnt play for over 20 years. Mostly though, because it was a bit intimidating. Now since being past that stage and picking up the guitar again, I am looking forward to this. Since theres about a billion ways to learn this, and everyone has a different way, I gave up years ago trying to make sense of it all. Looking forward to trying this from another angle.

Hey Thanks, If you have any questions I will try and answer them the best I can for you. Peace, jonesy

[hugo6969]

Jonesy and Big Dawg, thanks for the support and advice. Much appreciated. I got up this morning and started to read "Practical Guitar Theory" again. I got some stuff and understood but then I kept at it too long. So, now I'm sitting here with drool coming out of the corner of my mouth. Lol. I'll keep at it, it's just extremely frustrating. Yesterday I was ready to pull my hair out. Sorry, I wussed out. It's just intervals, modes, scales, circle of 5ths, augmented diminished, major, minor....AAAAAAhhhhhhhhhh!

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by hugo6969

Jonesy and Big Dawg, thanks for the support and advice. Much appreciated. I got up this morning and started to read "Practical Guitar Theory" again. I got some stuff and understood but then I kept at it too long. So, now I'm sitting here with drool coming out of the corner of my mouth. Lol. I'll keep at it, it's just extremely frustrating. Yesterday I was ready to pull my hair out. Sorry, I wussed out. It's just intervals, modes, scales, circle of 5ths, augmented diminished, major, minor....AAAAAAhhhhhhhhhh!

No problem..It's all good, don't forget to keep it simple. Basically all Music Theory is based off of the Major scale itself. So when you are studying or get confused always go back to the Major scale for reference. At this point don't worry about the Modes, or the circle of 5th's. But do learn intervals, the Major scale formula and how chords are constructed. Be able to understand the difference between a major and minor chord. Then some of the other more advanced things will make more sense.

If you look at it like musical kindergarten, the chromatic scale is your abc's, the chords are your words and chord progressions are your sentences. Music theory is a way of understanding the relationships of these chords/progressions as well as the scales that can be used with them.

[transparentbluefanatic]

You know thats exactly what my first teacher taguht me in the first 30min.

The next lesson we reviewed it. then we started working in a book and learning how to read

[jonesy]

That Steak Looks Good

[Big_dawg]

jonesy, still going through early stax stuff, but as it was 50 years ago one day this week I think we need to look at some classic rock'n'roll (this has nothing to do with me also getting a new fender amp.......honest!)

Ive got a few Johny Cash bits Im going through at the moment but no real early RnR....

[jus10]

Originally Posted by jonesy

No problem..It's all good, don't forget to keep it simple. Basically all Music Theory is based off of the Major scale itself. So when you are studying or get confused always go back to the Major scale for reference. At this point don't worry about the Modes, or the circle of 5th's. But do learn intervals, the Major scale formula and how chords are constructed. Be able to understand the difference between a major and minor chord. Then some of the other more advanced things will make more sense.

If you look at it like musical kindergarten, the chromatic scale is your abc's, the chords are your words and chord progressions are your sentences. Music theory is a way of understanding the relationships of these chords/progressions as well as the scales that can be used with them.

Exactly....modes are not your friend at first.

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Big_dawg

jonesy, still going through early stax stuff, but as it was 50 years ago one day this week I think we need to look at some classic rock'n'roll (this has nothing to do with me also getting a new fender amp.......honest!)

Ive got a few Johny Cash bits Im going through at the moment but no real early RnR....

Check this out dawg...

Stax Records

[jus10]

Did you catch the Stax show on pbs a couple months ago?

It was really comprehensive. Put me on stax kick for awhile.

"It's Soul Finger, by the Bar Kays".....best quote ever.

YouTube - Spies Like Us (1985) - Soul finger

YouTube - Spies Like Us (1985) - Soul finger

[jonesy]

No did not see that on pbs, but excellent video

[Big_dawg]

Originally Posted by jonesy

Check this out dawg...

Stax Records

Dammit Im supposed to be working... Oh well another morning written off!

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Big_dawg

Dammit Im supposed to be working... Oh well another morning written off!

Hows that new Fender amp working out for you?

[Big_dawg]

too well.... even the greeny out of phase LP sounds really good through it...

Actually when I got it (shop demo model - highly discounted as a result - played them before so didnt bother trying it out) the reverb didnt work - so I rang the shop up, spoke to the manager and hes replaced it with a brand new in the box one... - bargain!

For the previous year ive been playing through a tiny terror and a marshall VM2266 (now both gone) Id forgotton what a good clean sounds like - Ive got my tele twang back!! Borrowed a load of Sun Records cd's off my dad yeasterday so ill be working through them for a bit...

Will get pics up as soon as theres any decent light to take pics with...feels like weve been kinda living in a grey murky light lately, useless for photography...

[jonesy]

Congrats, Sounds like things worked out nice for you, always fun getting new gear to play on. I heard you have had the worst winter in 20 years? It has been bad here this year as well, but we did just recently have a break from the arctic cold and it got up to 60 here the other day and will probably make it over 50 today. Have fun with those old records...
Pics of your amp would would be sweet

[Big_dawg]

its cold, and its bad, but in the south east we seem to miss ay of the major weather that the uk gets - we had one day of snow and it melted by the time I got home from work - was actually really disappointed as I got home early so I could go out with my little boy and build snowmen...

I dont mind the cold Im at my happiest on the side of a mountain, in sub zero temps with blizzards blowing - providing ive got my snowboard. Cant wait for my boy to be old enough to come with me...

[jonesy]

We have had a bit if everything this year, the Cold -15, The Snow 12-24 inches at a time, Freezing Rain, you name it and it started back in November. I grew up in Michigan and am used to the snow, but the older you get, warmer is better

[jonesy]

[Kapeji]

Thanks for all your time and effort Jonesy, Great thread, I read a great deal of it but rushed through the last few pages to post a comment, I ordered the book Practical Theory for Guitar: Book & CD and look forward to getting to grips with it. The net is an awesome device, I am 55 have had a delight in electric guitars and blues and rock but have never made progress beyong very basic stuff, but I am ripping along now with all the stuff thats online, |Youtube videos (for those who are begining I must reccomend you check out Marty Schwarz, on youtube, his tutorials are nothing short of excellent)
and this thread, once again I am having much fun with music!

Cheers!

[jonesy]

Greetings and nice to hear from you. Yes I agree the internet is an amazing source of knowledge and it is much easier to learn guitar today then it was 20-30 years ago. Glad you are enjoying the thread, and if you have any specific questions feel free to post them and I will try and help if I can. Take care, and keep the Music flowing

peace, jonesy

[jonesy]

Transposing Keys to Songs With and Without a Capo

I found this in a Google search and it explains what Transposing means clearer than I could...and No author and I are not Related

Transposition: Changing Keys

Module by: Catherine Schmidt-Jones

Summary: Transposition, or changing the key of a piece of music, can be useful and is sometimes necessary to make music more singable or playable. Music is transposed by raising or lowering every note by the same interval.

Changing the key of a piece of music is called transposing the music. Music in a major key can be transposed to any other major key; music in a minor key can be transposed to any other minor key. (Changing a piece from minor to major or vice-versa requires many more changes than simple transposition.) A piece will also sound higher or lower once it is transposed. There are some ways to avoid having to do the transposition yourself, but learning to transpose can be very useful for performers, composers, and arrangers.

Why Transpose?

Here are the most common situations that may require you to change the key of a piece of music:


* To put it in the right key for your vocalists. If your singer or singers are struggling with notes that are too high or low, changing the key to put the music in their range will result in a much better performance.

*

Instrumentalists may also find that a piece is easier to play if it is in a different key. Players of both bowed and plucked strings generally find fingerings and tuning to be easier in sharp keys, while woodwind and brass players often find flat keys more comfortable and in tune.

*

Instrumentalists with transposing instruments will usually need any part they play to be properly transposed before they can play it. Clarinet, French horn, saxophone, trumpet, and cornet are the most common transposing instruments.



So with that said let's see how we can actually use it to help our playing, or singing. I think for the most part in the past I have changed keys because it was easier to sing in another key, or that it sounded better on the guitar played in a certain key. Here is an example...

Amazing Grace in the Key of G 3/4 Time

: G/G/C/G/G/G/D/D/G/G/C/G/Em/D/G/G :

Amazing Grace in the Key of C 3/4 Time

: C/C/F/C/C/C/G/G/C/C/F/C/Am/G/C/C :

Usually many people's voices will tend to sound more natural in one key or another. You can try moving the key up or down a whole step or two, but sometimes that is not enough. Going from the key of G to C or even D can work out better for the Vocalist or Guitarist performing the song. Sometimes you will need to find a key that works out for both.

TRANSPOSING WITH A CAPO
Every fret is a semitone or half step, so if you use a Capo on the second fret and it moves the key up 2 semi tones or one whole step. So if we are in the key of C and capo on 2nd fret we get the key of D


: D/D/G/D/D/D/A/A/D/D/G/D/Bm/D/D :

The Key of G on some songs can be to high or way to low for some people to sing, so you can switch Keys and Play the song in the key of C
Sometimes you may have to try several different keys out before you find the right one that works for what you are doing.

If you are playing acoustic guitar, and trying to stay away from doing barre chords like F#m and Bm you can use a capo to get around those types of problems as well. I Rarely use a capo, but I used to once in a while when I was playing guitar for a gal that sang a lot of Gospel.

Say you like the key of G, and can play G Em C D and someone wants to do a a song in the key of A, chords are A F#m D E and that F#m is taking all the joy out of it for you, you could capo on the second fret. That moves everything up one whole step like I mentioned earlier. So now you still play the chord shapes G Em C D but they sound like A F# D E because of the Capo moving up the pitch.

Now I am not saying to stop practicing your barre chords and if you practice long and hard enough you will be able to get the F#mm to ring clear with no buzzing when played on an acoustic guitar

Hope this helps some of you out, for others it may seem very basic.

peace, jonesy

[TurboSi]

Thanks Jonesy,

Keep up the good work

Si

[jonesy]

Your welcome, thanks for the interest bro
peace, jonesy

[HMIC]

I wish you guys had been around when I was in HS. I would have learned this stuff much more quickly if I hadn't had to wait for the next issue of GFTPM.

jonesy, you do a great job of making this stuff clear and easy to understand. You should do a book.

[HMIC]

...and armann's explanation of the modes of the major scale was great as well.

[jonesy]

Hey Thanks, glad you guys are reading this thread and getting something out of it

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by HMIC

...and armann's explanation of the modes of the major scale was great as well.

Yes I agree, where is Armann have not heard from him in a longtime???

[jonesy]

GOING FISHING, MAYBE YOU WILL CATCH SOMETHING???

I learned to play guitar like a lot of people did in the 70' & 80' by watching other people, reading my monthly guitar mags cover to cover, and playing along to records, cassette tapes(rewinding aaarrrgghh)and playing along with the Radio.

I grew up in southwestern Michigan and there was a small station around 95fm that was called WAOR. AOR stood for Album Orientated Rock, and the format was geared to resemble the Big Stations out of Chicago, WLUP and the likes.

Anyways WAOR 95FM always played a good Rock mix, the Who, AC/DC, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Van Morrison, Pink Floyd and what ever new that was coming out at that time. I got my Blues from 88.1 FM WVPE which is a college station still on air today I believe. That was like the Radio Station with the Stoner DJ's "Heyyyyy we willl beeeee, uh rr,right..uh. back(silence) with the "King Biscuit Flower Hour They Played some great blues,(intermittent dead air at times??) even the real old stuff. I think the may still have the Blues review on Saturday Mornings?

So anyways, I knew the Pentatonic or blues scale at that time and that was about it, and I had already spent some time cuing up Tres Hombres by ZZ Top over and over on vinyl trying to get just a few of the Rev, Billy Gibbons licks down. But back then before streaming digital no way to back up the Radio to get a part you missed.

So what I would do is first off try and find what "Key" that the song was in, there are 12 twelve Major Keys and 12 minor Keys. Once I found the Key signature I could use that scale to try and solo over the chord progression of that song, or figure out the chord progression.

I found the easiest way for my ear to locate the pitch was to try and find the "Root" note on my 1st or 2nd string, rather than on my lower strings.
Playing along the frets, and moving up and down chromatically(1 fret at a time) I would "Fish" around until I finally "Caught" the right Note(I could hear it) and identified that chord or Key signature I was trying to find. IMO playing along and searching like this, is the only way you can really train your ear and make it better. Once you find they key, then you go about trying to figure out the chord progressions of the various parts of the song, intro, verse, chorus etc.

I would spend a lot of time doing this, some times I would get it right away, and sometimes the song would be getting over before I have even figured out even a few of the chords.

Glad I did not have any tabs to rely on early on, or I probably would not have spent nearly the amount of time "Fishing" but it helped my ear big time.
I still use this exercise for teaching my students ear training.

I have a Father and two sons taking lessons together. The dad is a preacher and he takes dobro lessons from me and I teach one of the sons mandolin and the other keyboard. They brought in some CD's of some Gospel music done by some of their friends. I started playing along with them and figuring out the chords by ear and they just kind of sat there looking bewildered, like they couldn't believe that any could actually do that. In fact there are many musicians who play totally by ear and do not know any theory. I think you need to use both as tools to help you learn music and express yourself better.

Give a man a fish (tab) and feed him for a day, teach him how to Fish (ear) and he or she will a much better guitar player for the rest of their life, or something like that I suppose

Remember you Play how you Practice, so Practice good. And good luck "Fishing", I hope hope you catch a lot

peace, jonesy

[Big_dawg]

ggod post jonesy, I sometimes wish that the internet wasnt as good as it was, its really difficult trying to sit down and work out a song knowing the answer is only 2 clicks away...

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Big_dawg

ggod post jonesy, I sometimes wish that the internet wasnt as good as it was, its really difficult trying to sit down and work out a song knowing the answer is only 2 clicks away...

Thanks Dawg, Ha, yeah so true...but it's nice to have back up just to be sure. I remember learning "Boulevard of Broken dreams" by Green day off of the CD for my students. The song is in the key of Fm so it is all barre chords on elec, but I could hear the acoustic in the intro strumming open Em chord etc. So I capo'ed the acoustic at 1st fret and playing all open chords and it fit perfect. About as month later I bought a guitar magazine with a complete tab for that song, and it showed acoustic capo at 1, which made me happy I had gotten it correct by ear I am not sure If I would have figured that out by myself when I was first getting going on guitar. I try and encourage my students to use both their ear and tabs for learning.