LP Custom stolen and returned, Authenticate?

[andymuffins]

Hey guys,

I bought a 70-73 Gibson Les Paul Custom 4 years ago. In the 80's the LP was stolen on a military base and promptly recovered and returned to the rightful owner. I have a bill of sale signed and notarized by the provost marshall (Police chief of a military base) that's over 24 years old. I also have a bill of sale changing the ownership into my hands.

Here is my prediciment, when then it was stolen the thief tried to deface the serial number, he scratched part of it off. The only visible numbers are 1157 and "Made in the USA" underneath of that.

I'm interested in getting a Appx build date and a valuation.



Here is a black and white so you can see the contrast.





What do you guys think?

Andy

[General Disarray]

Andy - the pics don't seem to work here and the links in properties don't seem to work either.

Cool story though - hope we can help!

[dwagar]

Does it have any original pots? Best way to date a 70s Les Paul is by pot codes.

Look for 137YYWW - where YY is year, WW is week

[andymuffins]

Hey guys,

Don't know why the links won't work, go here for the gallery.

andymuffins : photos : Gibson- powered by SmugMug

[andymuffins]

You can view larger pictures of them if you put your cursor on the pic and click one of the options.

Thanks for your help!

BTW, which pot would you recommend looking at first?

Andy

[andymuffins]

Originally Posted by dwagar

Does it have any original pots? Best way to date a 70s Les Paul is by pot codes.

Look for 137YYWW - where YY is year, WW is week

The only thing that appears to be unoriginal is the tuners and the sound knobs.

Andy

[docadillac]

It is a true custom from that era. They did stamp "MADE IN USA" below the serial nos. The top carve is correct and you can the good wood beneath the paint. It does look like someone tried to scrape off the serial no in an attempt to make it unidentifiable. The Grover tuners are replacements as you can see the original holes for the screws on the original tuners. Nice vintage vibe goin' on there though along with a good story. Could anybody else confirm my thoughts as I'm going from very old memories here.

[dwagar]

I'm going to say it's a '74.

AFAIK '74 was the first year for this color (I have one). Mahogany neck means it's not later than '74.

Check the pots to confirm it though.

[andymuffins]

Ok guys,

The pot codes are 1377401. I take it that means it's a 1974 made in week 1 correct?

With the condition, defacement but largely original equipment, what would you say the value is of this this guitar??

Andy

[andymuffins]

BTW Dwagar, good call on knowing the year.

Andy

[dwagar]

well, the bad news is the defacement, the good news, white '74s seem to be way up there in value as far as Norlins go. Last time I checked GBase, there were 3 listed, $5K, $6K and $7K. I don't know what they REALLY sell them for though. May be significantly less than what they list them on GBase for. All I can suggest is watch EBay completed sales for a real price range.

FYI '74
- first year for this color, think Randy Rhoads
- last year for mahogany neck
- last year for trans tenon
- Kalamazoo plant
- should have stickered, not stamped, T Top pickups

I can't tell from the pic, does yours have the Anniversary inlay? Mine doesn't, I think most do, but definitely not all of them.

[andymuffins]

I can't tell from the pic, does yours have the Anniversary inlay? Mine doesn't, I think most do, but definitely not all of them.

What would the anniversery inlay look like?

I'm an ignorant guitar person, I bought this from my friend because he needed money. I'm not even sure what stamped or stickered pickups are. I know when the guitar was tuned it had patent stickers on the back of the pickups.

Dwagar, if you had to guess how much I should ask for this LP what would you say a good starting price would be? I'm in need of money as I have a fairly large real estate deal going through.

[dwagar]

here's a pic I stole off the net, you can just make out 'TWENTIETH ANNINVERSARY' on the 15th fret inlay.



As for real selling value, I don't know what to say.

[andymuffins]

It's definitely not a 20th then.

Thank you Dwagar for all of your help, you've been very helpful and it's much appreciated.

As far as method of selling, what do you recommend? Classifieds here? Gbase? Ebay?

Andy

[diceman]

No help here - but that is a beautiful guitar!!

[dwagar]

well, it IS a 20th (as it's a '74) it just doesn't have the inlay. I don't think there is any difference at all, except for that.

I'd suggest you fix the missing knob, etc. Maybe check with someone like BCR/Greg, he might have a better idea of real value. If I was selling, I'd set the value I wanted, and try the classifieds here and Craigslist local I think, before I'd try the crapshoot that is Ebay.

[docadillac]

As far as value the mid 70's Les Pauls are not that desirable IMHO. They were multi-piece bodies as opposed to one piece and were made during the Norlin era. There's really nothing special about them. The value would also be according to the condition of the guitar and it's playability. Do the pickups work correctly? Is the fretwear significant i.e. does it need a complete re-fretting. Is the truss rod broken? Are the caps and pots still good? If the guitar was in excellent condition it would worth no more than any other older Les Paul custom from the three previous decades. It looks like around $1000.00 in its current condition. I believe the top end of an excellent example would around $2000.00. You could also check various guitar value guides to see. But my evaluation is based on information I've gathered from a variety of different sources. I don't place much stock in what dealers ask on G-BASE or E-BAY. as they tend to want way too much for their instruments. Most buyers in the know have a ceiling for which they are prepared to go and it's not in the dealer price range. I am just basing this on my experiences with the guitar over the years. I'm sure you will find other opinions as well, you just have to do what you believe is the right thing for you.

[andymuffins]

You're probably right cadillac. I was hoping somewhere in the 2k range but I think you are correct in your assesment from the information I've been able to pick up.
Thank you all for your help. I really appreciate it.

Andy