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Unread 01-08-2009, 08:23 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Replacing Tuners

Gibson Guitars Online Store Catalog: Replacement Guitar Parts and Tuners, Machine Heads In Nickel Modern Finish

Will these fit in out of the box, in place of The Standard Perloid ones seen on 07 Standards?

Gibson® Modern Grover Nickel Machine Heads (Set of 6) - PMMH-015

Or am I better off with these Locking Grovers, do they fit out of the box?

Thanks in advance!
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Unread 01-08-2009, 08:41 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

I installed chrome locking Grovers from Stew-Mac in my new Custom and they fit without any modication.


Last edited by ehamady6; 01-08-2009 at 09:58 PM.
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Unread 01-08-2009, 08:48 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

So you can go between originals and locking tuners without ever drilling or anything? Great! So how do the locking tuners work and how well do they keep in tune? So instead of holding the string while winding (which I suck at, Im hopeless at string change..I know right.) it locks it in place so you dont have to hold the string. How does it lock the string..alittle button?
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Unread 01-08-2009, 09:30 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vintage_Burster View Post
So you can go between originals and locking tuners without ever drilling or anything? Great! So how do the locking tuners work and how well do they keep in tune? So instead of holding the string while winding (which I suck at, Im hopeless at string change..I know right.) it locks it in place so you dont have to hold the string. How does it lock the string..alittle button?
You won't have to do any drilling as long as it's a Gibson. The locking gears are inside the Grovers, where they are on the outside of most other brands. That keeps Grovers' lockers the same size as non-lockers so the holes line up the same. You can't even tell the difference cosmetically. There's a hole in each tuner's post that you feed the string thru then turn the peg until the gears lock onto the string. The post won't start rotating until the string is locked. No need for buttons or anything else and it usually takes only a single wrap.

The Grovers I installed have tall posts which decreases the angle of the strings between the nut and the tuners. This has resulted in much more sustain and lets the nut do its job without the strings binding in the groves. Of course lockers make string changes fast and they stay in tune better because fewer wraps around the posts decreases the chance of slipage, but I installed them for their sustain and that's exactly what I got. Everything else is icing on the cake. In conjunction with my TonePros locking tailpiece and locking bridge, the locking Grovers were one of the best mods I made on my new black LP Custom. I'm a metal player and hit the strings hard and the lockers perform beautifully and stay in tune, and because they're Grovers I can count on them and concentrate on just playing.

Last edited by ehamady6; 01-08-2009 at 10:03 PM.
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Unread 01-08-2009, 09:51 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Yeah I just upgraded to locking rotomatic grovers (the ones without the thumb screw on the back) and I think they are great....string changes are much faster and I think I hear a difference...but not sure because I did put new strings on, after all

Ah I got this here to help remove the tuners...they aren't screwed on very tight but this thing helped me not damage any part of the tuner or the guitar during removal or installation....and the good thing is you can get the tuners here too....uh...heh heh...you might have heard of this place:

http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tools/Sp...utdrivers.html
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Unread 01-08-2009, 09:51 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

If you check my original post, its the second link that are the ones I want. I dont like the kidney bean styled ones, one keystone. Are they the same as your ones, the "tall posts"?

Thanks again
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Unread 01-08-2009, 09:56 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Oh and, are they easy to install?

Im guessing all you have to do is slip them in and screw them in and there good to go?
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Unread 01-08-2009, 10:24 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

dont think those will be a direct fit your going to need to ream the hole out for them the 07 std has the smaller holes.
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Unread 01-08-2009, 10:56 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Really? Everyone else seems to think there fine..

Also, can you get the screw that hold the pickup rings in place at hardware stores? Mine are rusting alittle bit, I have really acidic sweat I think..yuck.
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Unread 01-08-2009, 11:05 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

rusty screws are part of the mojo of a guitar that is well loved.
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Unread 01-08-2009, 11:08 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

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Really? Everyone else seems to think there fine..

Also, can you get the screw that hold the pickup rings in place at hardware stores? Mine are rusting alittle bit, I have really acidic sweat I think..yuck.
pretty sure youll have to ream they went on ehamdy6's custom because it came with grovers,I may be wrong but....
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Unread 01-08-2009, 11:10 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

As far as I know the '07 Standards, at least mine, come with the Kluson style tuners with the smaller size press in bushings and two mounting screws. The Grovers you are looking at will most definitely not be a direct swap if you now have the keystone Klusons.
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Unread 01-08-2009, 11:13 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Hmm, Im not even sure if those links I post are Locking tuners. You can only get locking tuners in those kidney bean styled heads it seems..that sucks..
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Unread 01-09-2009, 08:33 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

you can get gotoh locking tuners that are a direct fit and are exactly like the stockers, someone here said that gotoh makes the stock tuners . I ve been contemplating getting them
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Unread 01-09-2009, 10:04 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Quote:
Originally Posted by 155 View Post
you can get gotoh locking tuners that are a direct fit and are exactly like the stockers, someone here said that gotoh makes the stock tuners . I ve been contemplating getting them
I installed them on my Studio and they work great. I originally wanted to install Sperzels, but I didn't want to drill new screw holes or ream out the peghead holes. The Gotohs will fit the factory screw holes without modification.

One thing to keep in mind though... All of my research into the subject indicated that I couldn't use the Sperzels or Grovers without reaming out the peghead holes. Supposedly the stock tuners used 9mm holes and most aftermarket tuners are 10mm. WRONG. I got my Gotoh tuners and proceeded to remove the stock Gibson Deluxe greenkeys only to discover that the peghead hole *was* 10mm. So I ended up having to order press-in conversion bushings from Stew-Mac. Turns out that the Gotoh units are a direct retrofit for the old style Klusons with press in bushings, like on a R8-R9. The newer Gibson Deluxe tuners don't use press-in bushings, they use a threaded sleeves that go through the peghead and screw into the body of the tuner.

Once installed I actually thought that the factory Gibson Deluze greenkeys were better mad to tighter tolerances - there is no wiggle in the shafts compared to the Gotohs. In use though the Gotohs are fine and work as advertised.
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Unread 01-09-2009, 10:06 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

You'll definitely have to ream the holes for the Rotomatics.

I'd personally stick with a set of Kluson-style. Tone Pros, and Gotoh make locking tuners that WILL fit perfectly.

Keep in mind, the more mass in the tuner, the less resonance, dynamics and openness the guitar will have. It will gain in sustain, however, but to many people, the trade off isn't worth it.

Grovers were the only replacement for many years, which is why many Les Pauls have them, but if your guitar didn't come with the installed, I'd stay away from them. They work great on Customs, but you don't want to put a drill to your Standard only to find out you don't like the new tone.
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Unread 01-09-2009, 01:50 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

These are what you want, and at the best price I've seen them. Direct fit replacement for Standards equipped with the Kluson type tuners. I have them on my '07 Standard GOTW #34, and my '08 Standard Faded. They appear to be identical in every way to the factory Gibson including the small 'Japan' stamping on the back, which suggests that the original Gibsons are indeed made by Gotoh. However, the included bushings do need to be installed. They are pretty easy to swap out.

Vintage Kluson Style Locking Tuners Nickel
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Unread 01-09-2009, 03:28 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Exactly! Nice...
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Unread 01-09-2009, 07:12 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Can you get locking tuners that fit in the kluson style but metal keystone, like seen on the 08 Standards?
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Unread 01-05-2011, 07:23 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

Hey everyone!

I'm in love with the Les Paul. I own an Epi LP Standard and just ordered an Epi LP Prophecy EX!

The thing I'm not satisfied with on the Standard are the tuners. I bought this back in 1998, when the Epis still came with the crappy Kluson style tuners. What I'm wondering is, will the Gibson PMMH-0015 Grover tuners fit without modification or will I need to make adjustments? I want chrome tulip head ones to go with the rest of the hardware.

Here's the guitar in question. The first thing I did was rip out the Epi original crappy pickups and put in Gibson 500T and 496R that someone took out of their brand new Explorer. Go figure.

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Unread 09-06-2011, 06:33 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Re: Replacing Tuners

If anyone cares, I did end up getting those tuners and having a friends who's a guitar tech replace them for me.

Aren't they gorgeous:
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