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Unread 04-26-2013, 11:42 AM   #1 (permalink)
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2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

OK I know this is asked a lot but I am not sure what to do. 2013 LP traditional with 57+ in the bridge with orange cap. Single notes are really shrill, it's not my amp or EQ as I have been using it for a while and have already adjusted the EQ accordingly.

Is the cap the culprit? If so, what do I replace it with?

I have a flying with with a JB in the bridge that I love. I also DIG the low end out of the LP and rolling back the tone isn't an option as we play a lot of changes (metal) and I need the high end for chords.

Already done:
EQ changes
pickup height
pole piece height

Thinking of a "darker" PUP but not sure which; really dig the "chug" when palm muting the 57+.

Thanks!
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Unread 04-26-2013, 11:47 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Ya those 57's get good reviews here but IMO they are a bit flabby. I'd try, before spending money, adjust pickup height. If that doesn't work try the Duncan's you mentioned. Go from there.

Sorry I read that you adjusted the pick up height a bit late. Again those 57's may not be for everyone. I swapped mine for Dimarzio 36th Anneversay PAF's. they are a bit tighter sounding, but may not be for you because you're looking for something darker...
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Unread 04-26-2013, 02:20 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

What cap value are you using .022?
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Unread 04-26-2013, 09:55 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

I had the exact same problem in my tradtional with the 57+ you need to find a different pickup!
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Unread 04-26-2013, 11:36 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

If you want a pickup with tone and balls , I highly recommend the BK Rebel Yell. works very nicely in a LP
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Unread 04-26-2013, 11:53 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

just dont put in a 498T... shrill devils, they be
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Unread 04-27-2013, 03:48 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Back the tone knob down to 8 and that will smooth out any ice pickiness.
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Unread 04-27-2013, 03:52 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Question Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Quote:
Originally Posted by liberator32 View Post
OK I know this is asked a lot but I am not sure what to do. 2013 LP traditional with 57+ in the bridge with orange cap. Single notes are really shrill, it's not my amp or EQ as I have been using it for a while and have already adjusted the EQ accordingly.

Is the cap the culprit? If so, what do I replace it with?

I have a flying with with a JB in the bridge that I love. I also DIG the low end out of the LP and rolling back the tone isn't an option as we play a lot of changes (metal) and I need the high end for chords.

Already done:
EQ changes
pickup height
pole piece height

Thinking of a "darker" PUP but not sure which; really dig the "chug" when palm muting the 57+.

Thanks!
"...it's not my amp or EQ as I have been using it for a while and have already adjusted the EQ accordingly."
Um, yeah it is.
Using the amp and guitar for a while and have adjusted them accordingly? To what? Obviously not to taste.

When you put a different guitar into the mix the entire setup of amp and EQ need tweaking. If they didn't sound entirely different why change guitars at all?
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Unread 04-27-2013, 04:25 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

just dont put in a Burstbucker... shrill devils, they be


The Duncan "Custom Custom" is designed for Brighter Guitars.

I thinking you have a different problem though.
I've never ran across a bright, shrill treble LP before.
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Unread 04-27-2013, 04:42 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

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I thinking you have a different problem though.
I've never ran across a bright, shrill treble LP before.
I was thinking that - My trad with '57s is the darkest sounding of my guitars to the point where I often have to eq the treble up, and I have a SG with a JB in the bridge that has the opposite problem.
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Unread 04-27-2013, 06:48 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryHatter View Post
"...it's not my amp or EQ as I have been using it for a while and have already adjusted the EQ accordingly."
Um, yeah it is.
Using the amp and guitar for a while and have adjusted them accordingly? To what? Obviously not to taste.

When you put a different guitar into the mix the entire setup of amp and EQ need tweaking. If they didn't sound entirely different why change guitars at all?
I meant that I know the amp by heart, I have adjusted the EQ to compensate for the guitar change and it boils down to the guitar being shrill in all amps I have tried it in.
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Unread 04-27-2013, 02:43 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Quote:
Originally Posted by liberator32 View Post
I meant that I know the amp by heart, I have adjusted the EQ to compensate for the guitar change and it boils down to the guitar being shrill in all amps I have tried it in.
Ah, gotcha.
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Unread 04-27-2013, 04:55 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

I have not yet gigged out with my 2012 Trad that has the 57+ bridge, however I recently had my 2011 Trad Pro out through a DSL and noticed the BB3 bridge definitely has a lot of 'top end', I wound up being fine with some eq changes.

People do call them 'trebley' also, but I am still a big fan of the 498T (and 490R combo) in my guitars. I guess its just what I'm used to and sounds 'right' to me, I think the BB3 has more top end than the 498T. I will probably get a 490R/498T for my Trad Pro to see if I can get it to 'my zone'.

I do wish that Gibson would publish more information about their pickups. I am a fan of their pickups and usually don't do aftermarket stuff, but if Gibson would publish some frequency related data for their pickups rather than just relative output I think we could all find our 'zone' a little better.
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Unread 04-27-2013, 05:17 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Quote:
Originally Posted by liberator32 View Post
OK I know this is asked a lot but I am not sure what to do. 2013 LP traditional with 57+ in the bridge with orange cap. Single notes are really shrill, it's not my amp or EQ as I have been using it for a while and have already adjusted the EQ accordingly.

Is the cap the culprit? If so, what do I replace it with?

I have a flying with with a JB in the bridge that I love. I also DIG the low end out of the LP and rolling back the tone isn't an option as we play a lot of changes (metal) and I need the high end for chords.

Already done:
EQ changes
pickup height
pole piece height

Thinking of a "darker" PUP but not sure which; really dig the "chug" when palm muting the 57+.

Thanks!
If you like the JB in the bridge of your flying V, and you want to keep the neckpup of your LP Trad, then you might need to get another JB for the LP Trad.

Another option you can choose (which also requires buying a new pup) would be getting a pup with a ceramic magnet that is hotter/more output and a higher DC resistance rating. This makes sense since you said you play metal. Pups with ceramic magnets are a little "darker" but are also very powerful in terms of output. I have a Seymour Duncan Parallel Axis Trembucker Distortion bridge pup and a SD PATB neck; both have ceramics mags; both have a unique winding, but the SD PATB Distortion has extreme output and a vicious DC Rating of over 21 K (fools in doubt can check it out: Seymour Duncan. Ceramics, high output, high DC resistance, yeah, it aint for everybody, and you damn well need to be sure that your amp is designed for some high gain tones and a tight output section in order to get the best out of these type of pups (no, sticking a mega distortion pedal inside a non-high gain amp aint gonna cut it).

Good luck.
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Unread 04-29-2013, 08:46 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

I think the JB is the answer. It's tried an true for me. My hesitancy lays in the fact that NONE of my other guitars with the JB have a maple cap. I had a JB in my last LP (2002 Classic) and it never sounded quite "right" to me, but that could have been a number of things.
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Unread 04-29-2013, 08:47 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Also, would you guys recommend keeping the orange drop cap. should I do a swap?
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Unread 04-30-2013, 06:56 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

I "zeroed" all the pole pieces and started fresh with an open mind. Problem solved, sorry if I wasted anyone's time. I appreciate those that offered advice.
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Unread 04-30-2013, 07:07 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

I'm surprised nobody asked for a recording.
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Unread 04-30-2013, 07:42 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Pics or it didn't happen.
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Unread 04-30-2013, 08:44 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

I know, me too. Here's me getting 35k views playing an acoustic guitar in my loft. Someday I will record some of the LP. I play in a metal band and it doesn't work so well recording at home in my loft.

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Unread 04-30-2013, 08:46 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Quote:
Originally Posted by M.C.J. View Post
If you like the JB in the bridge of your flying V, and you want to keep the neckpup of your LP Trad, then you might need to get another JB for the LP Trad.

Another option you can choose (which also requires buying a new pup) would be getting a pup with a ceramic magnet that is hotter/more output and a higher DC resistance rating. This makes sense since you said you play metal. Pups with ceramic magnets are a little "darker" but are also very powerful in terms of output. I have a Seymour Duncan Parallel Axis Trembucker Distortion bridge pup and a SD PATB neck; both have ceramics mags; both have a unique winding, but the SD PATB Distortion has extreme output and a vicious DC Rating of over 21 K (fools in doubt can check it out: Seymour Duncan. Ceramics, high output, high DC resistance, yeah, it aint for everybody, and you damn well need to be sure that your amp is designed for some high gain tones and a tight output section in order to get the best out of these type of pups (no, sticking a mega distortion pedal inside a non-high gain amp aint gonna cut it).

Good luck.
That's very interesting. I had a Studio Lite with the hot ceramics in it, and I loved the 500T in the bridge. It was warm and dark, just like nuclear fudge.
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Unread 08-16-2013, 10:53 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Do NOT change the pups.
I also bought a 2013 trad (First Gibson) a couple months ago, and it sounded good.
Then i started checking the set up...i got a MUCH better tone with playing around with the pup height and the pole pieces, plus yesterday i also discovered that the truss rod was completely wrong... it was way too straight, after sorting that out (Yes, only from the truss rod) i got a deeper sound, it was so straight that the harmonics on 5,7 fret were berely hearable.
Check everything first starting from the truss rod, bridge height then pup height and plz touch those pole pieces i couldnt even imagine the difference those screws would make
if u do all that and still dont like the tone of the bridge pickup, then yeah try something difrerent.
My 2 cents
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Unread 08-16-2013, 10:59 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Yes, before changing out the pups...rule out the wiring & electrical. Shrill is the complete opposite of how that 57 Classic Plus should sound.
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Unread 08-16-2013, 11:08 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

My trad pro is very, very bright for a Les Paul and can be shrill on the bridge P'up,whatever P'up happens to be there (it's awesome for the neck P'up though)

in the end I went with a lower value volume pot to roll off some of the highs in the circuit, used a rough cast AlNiCo 2 in whatever P'up I use there (seems a little smoother in the highs) and use a 0.033uf cap in a '50s wiring setup which is helping too

I went from not being able to find tones I liked on the Treble selection to loving it

I also wound my own pickup but I don't think you need to go that far
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Unread 08-16-2013, 11:24 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

[QUOTE=liberator32;5067863]OK I know this is asked a lot but I am not sure what to do. 2013 LP traditional with 57+ in the bridge with orange cap. Single notes are really shrill, it's not my amp or EQ as I have been using it for a while and have already adjusted the EQ accordingly.

Is the cap the culprit? If so, what do I replace it with?

Nylon saddles..
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Unread 08-16-2013, 11:31 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

We are replying to an old thread. Question to Liberator32... Did you ever get things sorted out?
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Unread 08-16-2013, 11:38 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Re: 2013 LP Traditional Shrill treble question

Couple things....

If your guitar comes with 500K volume pots, going with a 250-300K pots will warm/tame some of the high end. In fact, with the Duncan JB in particular, you're probably better off with a 250-300K pots so it doesn't get too harsh.

Also, from my own experience, the 57+ has always seemed a bit harsh. It's supposed to be an overwound 57 Classic, but for some reason has always sounded harsher to me, instead of 'meatier'. I think the regular 57 Classic is fine in the bridge with some height/pole adjustments.

But this is based around some relatively clean to overdriven blues-rock sounds. If metal is your thing, you probably want something with good meat AND 'cut'...JB may be a good starting point....or perhaps a Custom 5.
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