A Les Paul Custom built with Richlite!!!

[JB6464]

Gibson should buy all the Ebony they can from Stewmac since it's so cheap and they would'nt have to deal with any customs paperwork to screw up on .

[Mad Scientist]

As a hobby I also build and fly R/C and Control Line model airplanes. Well last year my father and I were at a contest and I was listening to all the oldsters complain that their hobby (control line) wasn't attracting newer and younger members. I stated that young people like electrics and don't wanna' mess with cantankerous, greasy, inconsistent running old two strokes that sound like angry hornets. You wanna' get a young person involved in the hobby? Get into electrics. You can take them anywhere and you can fly them anywhere including large indoor gyms. Electric is the future for model airplanes.

They way they looked at me youd've thought I'd insulted their mothers.

And no matter what the "oldsters" say, plastic and alternative woods are the future for guitars. Solid state, "modeled" amps are the future as well.

I'm not saying that I totally like it or agree with it, but I'm just saying that's how it looks to me so I think we need to accept it and adapt to it.

[irocdave12]

My whole point was that people associate Customs with having ebony fretboards and I think its a mistake to make them with anything thing else and still call them a Custom. They are still trying to mass market the guitar by using the richlite but I think they should just get small quanities of ebony legally and make the guitar more exclusive and expensive rather than what seems like a move that cheapens its history. Just my opinions, but they are my favorite of all LP's and I would rather see them put the Custom on vacation rather than make them this way. If they want to make a guitar that has the Custom look thats fine but call it something else because its not the same guitar that people have had come to mind for the last 5 decades when you think of what a Custom is

[stinkfoot]

Well.. for those who don't want a Custom with richlite or the other ones with the baked maple. Gibson just sent this out.. LP Custom with a..... drum roll...




(layered) Rosewood fretboard..

Gibson.com: Gibson Les Paul Custom Rosewood Maduro

I guess.. if you can't beat the Chinese fakers.. join them!

[Thumpalumpacus]

Originally Posted by JB6464

Wait until you have to refret that thing,then the real truth will come out.

That doesn't seem to be an issue with refretting Martins.

http://theunofficialmartinguitarforu...8#.T0k67Xls_4s

The fingerboard on this guitar is also micarta. I'll say this for the non-traditional material; it's a joy to re-fret. There's never any chipping of the fingerboard to tend to when pulling the frets and I don't ever have to level it as it doesn't warp. I just need to clean up the grime that's gotten under the frets before I start installing the new frets.

And they go in like a dream, nice and easy. I've almost got them all in and on an ebony fingerboard I'd still be leveling it. This is going fast.

I'll use my Taylor Fret Buck to support the delicate fingerboard extension as I finish installing the frets.

Done and done! The frets are all in, leveled, crowned, and polished and it went fast and easy.





http://guitar-repair-milwaukee.blogs...nd-saddle.html

I agree with Irocdave that it should be called something else in order to preserve product identity.

[guitarbob123]

Just saying, a lot of people are probably going to buy these without realising. Gibson should let people know about major spec changes imo.

[JB6464]

Originally Posted by stinkfoot

Well.. for those who don't want a Custom with richlite or the other ones with the baked maple. Gibson just sent this out.. LP Custom with a..... drum roll...




(layered) Rosewood fretboard..

Gibson.com: Gibson Les Paul Custom Rosewood Maduro

I guess.. if you can't beat the Chinese fakers.. join them!

Well to me it's still not a traditional Custom LP.
Layered Rosewood fretboards won't have the top end snap of Solid Ebony fretboard , and orginal customs don't have maple caps, only the 68 RI LP's.
So i'll still pass and buy a used one.

[JB6464]

Originally Posted by Thumpalumpacus

That doesn't seem to be an issue with refretting Martins.

re-fretting micarta fingerboard - any special considerations in Technical Info Forum







I agree with Irocdave that it should be called something else in order to preserve product identity.

I don't think Richlite and Micarta wood is the same material.

[River]

Originally Posted by guitarbob123

Just saying, a lot of people are probably going to buy these without realising. Gibson should let people know about major spec changes imo.

Or realizing and not giving a shit!

I understand some people's preference for ebony. If they cannot find the guitar they want with an ebony board, I feel genuine pity for them. I simply cannot believe, however, that is the case. If I'm right, they're whining about a horse losing the race when they had no bet down.

Richlite makes a damned fine fret board, you can't tell what it is without 20/20 vision from less than three feet, and it feels and sounds so much the same that I dare anyone to identify it in a blindfolded, strings-on, playing test.

[jlb32]

I guess the days of what most consider a "Custom" with the ebony fretboard and diamond headstock logo are over.

IMO bad move by Gibson at least at this point in time. IMO way to early to start messing with your most highly thought of models.

They could have made Custom Shop guitars with these new fretboard woods and not had them be "Customs". They could have substituted the diamond inlay for something else for the time being and called them Custom Shop models while leaving the "Custom" name/heritage alone until things are more sorted.

[JB6464]

Originally Posted by River

Or realizing and not giving a shit!

I understand some people's preference for ebony. If they cannot find the guitar they want with an ebony board, I feel genuine pity for them. I simply cannot believe, however, that is the case. If I'm right, they're whining about a horse losing the race when they had no bet down.

Richlite makes a damned fine fret board, you can't tell what it is without 20/20 vision from less than three feet, and it feels and sounds so much the same that I dare anyone to identify it in a blindfolded, strings-on, playing test.

Thats fine if it's a lower line priced guitar , but for someone to pay over $3000 and not get the traditional material Gibson has always used is a different story. You might as well buy a clone from someone else.
If they do this to the Historic guitars , how could they even call it a true Historic LP if they Never used that kind of material in the first place ?
That should be a crime !

[budg]

Stewmac can sell ebony boards for 33 bucks to say 500 people , but if they had to supply 5000 boards I would be willing to bet they would have a problem keeping up with the demand. All of a sudden their suppliers and prices would change .

[ed1996]

Those who have tried richlite have said it's a fantastic fretboard material. Everyone else complains about it.

[Luckynumber3]

Originally Posted by ed1996

Those who have tried richlite have said it's a fantastic fretboard material. Everyone else complains about it.

+1. I actually want to try one as it looks pretty nice!

And what do people want gibson to do? If they discontinued customs, people would go insane! And yet, Gibson can't legally make any guitars out of ebony, so they have to make them out of something else, so then people are mad that there are no ebony customs.

At this point in time, you can only legally build a custom with a different fretboard or no custom at all, and either way makes people angry apparently.

[Lysol]

Originally Posted by Ansen

"The pickups are Gibson’s 490R in the neck position, which offers the tonal characteristics of the original PAFs, and the 498T in the bridge position, which swaps the 490R’s Alnico II magnet for an Alnico V, thus making it slightly hotter with emphasis on mid-ranges and highs."

Just wonder, noone mentioned it..

These pickups are standard in this model and have been for a long time.


BTW, I like all the new FB options. Obeche sounds fvcking brilliant for one.

[JB6464]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber3

+1. I actually want to try one as it looks pretty nice!

And what do people want gibson to do? If they discontinued customs, people would go insane! And yet, Gibson can't legally make any guitars out of ebony, so they have to make them out of something else, so then people are mad that there are no ebony customs.

At this point in time, you can only legally build a custom with a different fretboard or no custom at all, and either way makes people angry apparently.

What are you smoking , "Can't legally build a guitar with Ebony" ?

Gibson can buy more Ebony anytime they want to spend the cash just like PRS,CARVIN,FENDER,JACKSON,CHARVEL,etc,etc,does and do all day long with no shortages.
They just choose to stop at this moment and try their experimental LP projects to see if they will sell as well and hope most people won't mind the different woods being used.

[Luckynumber3]

Originally Posted by JB6464

What are you smoking , "Can't legally build a guitar with Ebony" ?

Gibson can buy more Ebony anytime they want to spend the cash just like PRS,CARVIN,FENDER,JACKSON,CHARVEL,etc,etc,does and do all day long with no shortages.
They just choose to stop at this moment and try their experimental LP projects to see if they will sell as well and hope most people won't mind the different woods being used.

Same issue as the rosewood- they aren't supposed to buy rosewood due to the raid, and they can't get ebony either.

[JB6464]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber3

Same issue as the rosewood- they aren't supposed to buy rosewood due to the raid, and they can't get ebony either.

What they had got confiscated yes , but there is no law saying they can't buy more Ebony or Rosewood.
They just have to fork out the cash all over again and this time do it correctly and legally.
Gibson's idea is to start using alternative woods so they won't fall back into the same trap again because they employ loosers who can't properly purchase the material correctly.

[jlb32]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber3

Gibson can't legally make any guitars out of ebony, so they have to make them out of something else, so then people are mad that there are no ebony customs.

Where did this information come from? I have read nothing about charges or restrictions on Gibson.

If the FED has enough evidence to control what wood Gibson buys and doesn't buy then where are the charges? No other USA manufacturer is having issues with ebony and rosewood.

[stinkfoot]

I wonder if they'll bring back the pancake bodies..

[Luckynumber3]

Originally Posted by JB6464

What they had got confiscated yes , but there is no law saying they can't buy more Ebony or Rosewood.
They just have to fork out the cash all over again and this time do it correctly and legally.
Gibson's idea is to start using alternative woods so they won't fall back into the same trap again because they employ loosers who can't properly purchase the material correctly.

See below.

Originally Posted by jlb32

Where did this information come from? I have read nothing about charges or restrictions on Gibson.

If the FED has enough evidence to control what wood Gibson buys and doesn't buy then where are the charges? No other USA manufacturer is having issues with ebony and rosewood.

Going off of what I have read online, which is what everyone else is doing.

As far as I know, Henry was told not to make any lps with indian rosewood fretboards, but decided to make the piece ones anyways, and gibson is apparently in equal trouble with the ebony (which they were raided for in 2009)

As for me, I don't know if I would pay the same for a custom with Richlite, but I still am interested (Of course, I don't think i'd ever buy a new custom anyways, ebony or not...).

Originally Posted by stinkfoot

I wonder if they'll bring back the pancake bodies..

They already have made a few pancake body reissues (seen some plain custom reissues, but the new ace signature has a pancake body I believe).

[River side]

Originally Posted by River

... If I'm right, they're whining about a horse losing the race when they had no bet down.

I think there's room for honest disappointment in that some of us, for years upon years, have been led to believe that only the most exotic of materials carefully gathered from some of the most remote places on earth were what made some of these guitar models so damn special.

Now it's looking like that is not the case, and probably never was.

I don't have to be in the market today to sense that some bullshit happened, or is happening now.

But other than that, I'm genuinely happy for folks who feel uplifted by their new purchases.

[JB6464]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber3

See below.

Going off of what I have read online, which is what everyone else is doing.

As far as I know, Henry was told not to make any lps with indian rosewood fretboards, but decided to make the piece ones anyways, and gibson is apparently in equal trouble with the ebony (which they were raided for in 2009)

As for me, I don't know if I would pay the same for a custom with Richlite, but I still am interested (Of course, I don't think i'd ever buy a new custom anyways, ebony or not...).

They already have made a few pancake body reissues (seen some plain custom reissues, but the new ace signature has a pancake body I believe).

That's not what i've been reading,i disagree.
And if that's the real deal case , the Historic Department is screwed.

[budg]

Originally Posted by JB6464

That's not what i've been reading,i disagree.
And if that's the real deal case , the Historic Department is screwed.

Of course , if you read it on the internet it must be true.

[jlb32]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber3

See below.

Going off of what I have read online, which is what everyone else is doing.

As far as I know, Henry was told not to make any lps with indian rosewood fretboards, but decided to make the piece ones anyways, and gibson is apparently in equal trouble with the ebony (which they were raided for in 2009)

Like I said, where is this information coming from? Where is the link to this info since it seems I'm not the only one that has not heard anything resembling the FED telling Gibson to not use Indian rosewood or ebony?

If what you are saying is all over the internet I doubt there would even be any threads about the different fretboard wood since it would be obvious why Gibson is doing it.

[Luckynumber3]

Originally Posted by JB6464

That's not what i've been reading,i disagree.
And if that's the real deal case , the Historic Department is screwed.

I have read that the historics are supposed ot be getting those 2 piece fretboards this year, but at the same time, I have seen evidencwe of at least 1 historic from 2012 that had a 1 piece fretboard.

Originally Posted by budg

Of course , if you read it on the internet it must be true.

The whole Gibson incident has all been talked about on the internet.

In fact, there is so much BS it is hard to decipher what is true and false, and even gibson and the government seem to each have their own tale of what happened.

I might as well create some blog on the internet and make up some BS facts- will probably be as accurate as everything we hear now. I mean really, I don't think anybody knows entirely what is going on at gibson, not even the stores that actually sell them...

[Luckynumber3]

Originally Posted by jlb32

Like I said, where is this information coming from? Where is the link to this info since it seems I'm not the only one that has not heard anything resembling the FED telling Gibson to not use Indian rosewood or ebony?

If what you are saying is all over the internet I doubt there would even be any threads about the different fretboard wood since it would be obvious why Gibson is doing it.

I read it another thread.

Quite honestly, if people would stop making "OMG, gibson has another guitar with a new fretboard!" threads, maybe I could actually keep track of something, and go back and find it.

I know I have seen at least 3 or 4 threads showing the maduro brown custom over the past few weeks- people keep plopping out the same threads about the same thing and everyone seems to instantly hate something they don't even know about about.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Originally Posted by JB6464

I don't think Richlite and Micarta wood is the same material.

It's chemically very similar; they are both phenolic resins. The only difference is that Richlite has some recycled paper mixed is, while micarta uses cotton fibers.

Martin has used both in their guitars, Richlite for the last three years or so, and Micarta for the last decade. Steinberger has used phenolic 'boards for three decades, and Parker for two. I haven't heard of refretting issues with those guitars (although with stainless steel frets, I doubt the Parker is going to have any this soon).

The only difference I've read about between phenolic fretboards and wood regarding refrets (and this is only word-of-mouth) is that phenolics don't splinter like dry wood 'boards have been known to do.

[budg]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber3

I read it another thread.

Quite honestly, if people would stop making "OMG, gibson has another guitar with a new fretboard!" threads, maybe I could actually keep track of something, and go back and find it.

I know I have seen at least 3 or 4 threads showing the maduro brown custom over the past few weeks- people keep plopping out the same threads about the same thing and everyone seems to instantly hate something they don't even know about about.

I agree with you.I have yet to find clear facts about either raid.I am reserving judgement at this time. As far as all the different threads, alot of it is nothing more than piling on from people that know noting more than Gibson has deviated from the norm. Most of these people havent even played a richlite board .All they know is it isnt ebony.I played my Midtown before I even knew what it was and I was impressed enough that I bought it.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber3

As far as I know, Henry was told not to make any lps with indian rosewood fretboards, but decided to make the piece ones anyways, and gibson is apparently in equal trouble with the ebony (which they were raided for in 2009)

Well, what you heard is wrong, I think. I mean, it's entirely possible that the Justice Department or FWS has issued such an illegal order aimed at Gibson alone, but I doubt that it happened, considering that Gibson hasn't appealed this alleged "order".

Do you think Henry would've had his press conference and not mentioned such an overreach of power? After all, such a claim would support his narrative of the issue perfectly ("American company persecuted by Federal government!"). Why not say that it happened, if it did? No mention of it in this interview, either. Indeed, Henry goes out of his way to state that they had no communication with the Government at all prior to the August raid.

No, it's nonsense that Gibson was told any such thing, I think. Without a srouce, I'd discount such a claim.