Update On My Fake Epiphone and Amazon

[KWKSLVR]

Referenced in the Fake Epi thread The Fake Epiphone Thread II.

I quickly and naively purchased a Silverburst Epi off of Amazon early in January of this year when I saw the price. I was looking to get back into playing guitar and like all great excuses to purchase, nothing gets ya going like a new guitar. Being Amazon, I assumed to much. Needless to say, I had the guitar in my hands for 4 months before discovering the fake epi thread.

I emailed the seller, and called Amazon the next day. Amazon told me to give the dude 3 business days to get back to me. I gave him 4 even though I wasn't gonna hear a thing. So I called Amazon again with low expectations. I explained that the guitar was a fake, and that I could provide documentation. I then told them basically, "look, I know I've had this thing for 4 months and I'm beyond the time frame for a refund, I just don't want anyone else to get ripped off". She asked me if I still had the return address, which I didn't since it was written on the yellow packing tape in black sharpie. She then told me, "They will look into the seller, it usually takes 5-10 business days but if they can't get a response and can't determine a return address then we will refund you money and you get to keep the item".

- I thought. But, ok, whatever, I'll let it play through. This past Saturday they actually refunded the $575 (including expedited shipping) to my debit card and since there's no return address for this dude I get to keep one fake silverburst.

Although I'm not quite sure what to do with it. At any rate, kudos to Amazon. That's great customer service in my book.

[ext1jdh]

/me checks amazon and gets his card ready...

[rockstar232007]

Glad everything worked out!

It's still kind of sucks though, because the seller still technically got away with fraud, but at least you learned a very important lesson.

[KWKSLVR]

That part, I'm not sure of. A friend of mine has done some selling on Amazon before. He told me that they require a CC and access to 1 bank account so it's likely they just sucked the funds from the seller's account. He also made another good point, I've been buying off of Amazon with the same ID for years. I've spent thousands. This was the first time I've ever made a complaint so we're thinking that maybe they took that into account as well.

I also think I read somewhere that you get a lifetime dollar amount refunded back to you, like 2K or something like that. But I'm not sure of the details. I'm definitely lucky. I actually feel bad about still having this guitar (since it actually is well made, sounds ok and I didn't pay for it). But at least no one else can get ripped off as long as its in my possession.

[KWKSLVR]

Sidebar - what makes me so disappointed in myself is the fact that I'm a fraud investigator for a living.

[rockstar232007]

Originally Posted by KWKSLVR

Sidebar - what makes me so disappointed in myself is the fact that I'm a fraud investigator for a living.

That doesn't make you immune. Nowadays it's very easy to get duped, no matter who you are. In fact, there are cork-sniffing, Tom Wittrock-wannabe, 'burst' collectors who have been fooled by fake vintage LPs (real Gibsons, but not really vintage), and most of them have been dealing with real vintage LPs for most of their lives!

[standard man]

Sucks you got stung. Looks like you came out ahead on that deal though.

[Phildog]

Believe me, Amazon will get their money back. That's why they told you to keep the LP. I'm thankful for the "Fake" thread. It's helped me a lot. And we're glad it was able to help you too. I wonder how many people unknowingly buy fake guitars. The numbers are probably staggering.

Glad your situation worked out though. Enjoy your new LP.

Hey, pics please!!!

[xxjagerxx]

Kudos to amazon,and kudos to guys like shifty on the fake epi thread.

[-=[Shifty]=-]

Awesome. It's good to hear that everything worked out for you.

I'd keep the guitar and play it. If you should ever decide to pass it along, just get a stamp and impress "FAKE" on the back of the headstock.
That way you can make sure that it'll never pass as the real deal again.

[Brian_C]

That's a bit of result and fair play to Amazon for their customer service. Surely, if they have access to his CC and 1 bank account they would know his address. I wonder, legally, if it's a fake do you have to return. Probably not.

On a differant note - do you have photo's of the said guitar - Do the pick-ups have the Epiphone logo stamped on them? Does the bridge have Epiphone printed/embosed on the underside? I ask this becuase I have heard these fakers are acutally putting the stamps on them.

[KWKSLVR]

Brian - It doesn't have Epiphone stamped on the pickups. It did have those clear epiphone static cling stickers on the pickups and came in an Epi box, with an Epi poster and an Epi owners manual. Clearly they attempted to deceive and I've heard of some people that sell them advertised as what they are - fakes. Pics: Index of /temp/guitars/sb

I need to put up some pics of the Gibson Studio Deluxe I bought to "medicate" this heartbreaking discovery . Here's small ones of that one. Index of /temp/guitars/studiodeluxe

[04renostar]

Originally Posted by KWKSLVR

I need to put up some pics of the Gibson Studio Deluxe I bought to "medicate" this heartbreaking discovery . Here's small ones of that one. Index of /temp/guitars/studiodeluxe

Nice to hear that Amazon did ya right. Congrats on that.

As for the Deluxe, that's some medication that I'd gladly swallow. Bet your heartbreak healed nicely once you got your hands on that one. It's sweet! I hope to be as lucky as you and have one of those one day soon.

[KWKSLVR]

Well, ya know, when you buy a $1000+ guitar and then get refunded $575, it makes spending that money easier to swallow. I'm a HUGE penny pincher, which I guess is why I can afford to spend that every so often. I figure that money is a good start to my Bonamassa Signature Epi that I'd like to have when they come out later this year (if the Epiphone version actually has what they say it'll have). I love guitars, I think they're beautiful in general, but I don't play enough or well enough to probably justify owning the 8 I have! I guess that gives me player status.

[AK Epi Player]

Originally Posted by Brian_C

On a differant note - do you have photo's of the said guitar - Do the pick-ups have the Epiphone logo stamped on them? Does the bridge have Epiphone printed/embosed on the underside? I ask this becuase I have heard these fakers are acutally putting the stamps on them.

^^ My "EE" Black Beauty fake has the stamped "Epiphone" logo on the bottoms of the PU's, and the tail stop and bridge both have the Epi logo cast into them.

Originally Posted by KWKSLVR

I love guitars, I think they're beautiful in general, but I don't play enough or well enough to probably justify owning the 8 I have! I guess that gives me player status.

I'm in the same boat my friend I have 5 now, and just wish I had more time to practice.

[KWKSLVR]

BWHAHAHAHA!!!! Well, this guy finally got back to me now that he's missing nearly $600 out of his checking account. He's asking me to send him my email address so that he can send me the return address. How lame if this dude thinks I'm taking the transaction off of Amazon. It's a shame I'm out of town for the next several days and thus am unavailable to touch base with him.

[paulygates]

I have a similar story. I bought a SM58 from an Amazon seller and the price was too good to be true. Well you know what they say about that!! As soon as I received it I did some online research and confirmed my suspicion that it was fake. I even sent pics to Shure and they confirmed it.

I contacted Amazon and they contacted the seller. He quickly gave me a refund and asked me to return the mic. I kept it. Maybe that was wrong but if I returned it he could sell it again. Plus I would be paying for postage. It is not a bad mic. A tad brighter than a real one but useful as a spare.

I'm glad it worked out for you, KWKSLVR.

[mgridgaway]

Originally Posted by KWKSLVR

BWHAHAHAHA!!!! Well, this guy finally got back to me now that he's missing nearly $600 out of his checking account. He's asking me to send him my email address so that he can send me the return address. How lame if this dude thinks I'm taking the transaction off of Amazon. It's a shame I'm out of town for the next several days and thus am unavailable to touch base with him.

Psh... If Amazon told you to keep it, keep it. The seller has no recourse. What is he gonna do with it? Resell it to another unsuspecting dude?

[Chilli]

Yeah keep it you're doing everyone a favour, The seller can go swivel. Why would you want to send them your e-mail address you probably get bombarded with spam forever trying to sell you fake stuff.I like the idea of stamping i t "fake " though.

[KWKSLVR]

Originally Posted by mgridgaway

Psh... If Amazon told you to keep it, keep it. The seller has no recourse. What is he gonna do with it? Resell it to another unsuspecting dude?

It's not him I'm concerned about, it's Amazon yanking the cash back out of my account after putting it in because he complains to them.

[GilmourD]

Originally Posted by KWKSLVR

It's not him I'm concerned about, it's Amazon yanking the cash back out of my account after putting it in because he complains to them.

Tell them that he contacted you and you feel he's trying to further scam you.

[mgridgaway]

Originally Posted by KWKSLVR

It's not him I'm concerned about, it's Amazon yanking the cash back out of my account after putting it in because he complains to them.

If they do that, redirect them to the email specifically stating that you should keep the guitar and receive an refund. Tell them you wanted to do no further business with the seller unless required by Amazon.

[KWKSLVR]

That was told to me verbally. Come to think of it, I may take this conversation with him "off Amazon". After all, once it's off of Amazon and they are no longer a 3rd party, what's it to them.

[GilmourD]

Originally Posted by KWKSLVR

That was told to me verbally. Come to think of it, I may take this conversation with him "off Amazon". After all, once it's off of Amazon and they are no longer a 3rd party, what's it to them.

Well, the thing is that they offer you protection. If you communicate and deal outside of Amazon, they can't protect you if he screws you.

[KWKSLVR]

I don't see how he can screw me. Amazon has already refunded me. I know their policy is that the buyer has to pay return shipping, but this dude is smoking crack if he thinks I'm paying out of pocket to send back a fake guitar that he advertised as genuine (especially overseas).

I hate to essentially put a fake back on the market, but it's still not right to keep something you didn't pay for. At the same time, I doubt Amazon can reverse a refund. I'll have to read their policy.

[Sinster]

Keep the guitar. Tell the seller to go screw himself and also tell him to take you to court. Also e-mail him and explained that you tried several times to contact him about a how he sold you a fake guitar and that you wanted a refund. That he never responded and that the only time he responded is when he realize that Amazon reversed that charges from his account. Make sure you keep all your e-mails associated with this whole transaction. Make sure you also have the proof on the authenticity of the guitar.

[guitarcrazy]

That's great that Amazon came through for you.

[GilmourD]

Originally Posted by Sinster

Keep the guitar. Tell the seller to go screw himself and also tell him to take you to court. Also e-mail him and explained that you tried several times to contact him about a how he sold you a fake guitar and that you wanted a refund. That he never responded and that the only time he responded is when he realize that Amazon reversed that charges from his account. Make sure you keep all your e-mails associated with this whole transaction. Make sure you also have the proof on the authenticity of the guitar.

This. Seriously.

[KWKSLVR]

Ok, here's the chain of communication on this one. I'm gonna mess with this guy hardcore.

dear, patrick, i have refund your full payment some days ago, hope you have received it , according to amazon' refund policy, you should ship the guitar back to us after you receive your full payment, so please tell me your email address so that we can sent the detail return information to you at once, looking fordward to hear from you. regard

There you are! Thank you for your email, it's great to hear from you. I'm keeping our communication inside the Amazon system in case I need them to review this case again in the future. Please send me your return address via this messaging system. I will also need a proper guitar box and packing styrofoam along with a prepaid return label as the original packing materials were disposed of some time ago.

RE: Return information from Amazon seller salaeup-store
From: salaeup-store
Sent: Monday, May 31, 2010 1:16 AM
To: Patrick B Ray


dear, customer, it is great to hear from you,
first choice: please sent the guitar to those address and tell me the tracking number after you ship it to these address
Return address:
Mrs Huihong Huang
83-23 Broadway #1F
Elmhurs
New York
11373
U.S.A

Second Choice: by the way, could you consider to hold the guitar , if you like it and continue to keep it, i am happy to sold it at a very low price that is 150 dollors .and you should pay it by bank transfer , i think it is really the best and convient way to deal with the issue, is it okey??
please tell me which choice you would like , look forward to hear from you!! thank you very much for your understand.

regard

This return address is for Hua Rong Chinese Restaurant in Elmhurst NY...Chinatown! ROFL, I'm gonna have some fun with this one.

[KWKSLVR]

dear, seller, it is great to hear from you. I am unable to keep the guitar. It is actually of poor quality and the neck is warped rendering the guitar unplayable. That is how i discovered that you were selling fake epiphone guitars and advertising them as real. This would have been much simpler if you had replied to me in the beginning as i spent quite a large sum of money on repairing the electronics to attempt to make it somewhat playable. When you send me packing materials and a prepaid return label there will be a tracking number included. I recommend using ups.

I suppose i could keep the guitar, but in order to do that i will need you to go downstairs to hua rong restaurant and send me:
1 x beef with broccoli
1 x general tao's chicken
1 x kung-poo chicken with peanuts
1 x chicken in garlic sauce
1 x shredded pork peking style
4 x chicken egg roll
2 x vegetable egg roll
3 x shrimp egg roll

this should be an adequate terms of barter. Have a blessed memorial day

bwhahahaha