Dulling Poly Finished Guitars PIC HEAVY!!

[soldatopazzo]

Originally Posted by RMC1

I`ve seen quite a few threads about this,which got me curious as to how to achieve a less shiny finish to our Epi`s.As much as i love my Epi`s,i have always been frustrated by how our industrious little friends in Asia seem to go nuts with the Poly Gun.Sanding is an option,but that then creates a lot of work trying to eliminate scratches to the Poly which are sometimes too deep to remove without heavy sanding.That then in turn leads to uneven finishing of the surface,and that can lead to frustration,and occasionally,a ruined Guitar.This is by no means a definative Guide,it is also not an attempt to make a Poly covered Guitar look like a Nitro finished Guitar.It is what it is,a way to reduce the shine on an Epiphone Poly coated Guitar.Some people will think that this Guide sucks,others may like it.If you have no patience,i should mention that this method is most likely not for you.I figured i`d post it anyway

All in all,about 9 hours work.

So,lets get started.

We`re all aware of just how shiny that Finish is,to me it really does make the Guitar look like a Toy.A typical example of that below,



After experimenting with several methods,below is the Weapon of choice.Hang on!! you`re thinking i`m nuts and that the Sander will wreck the top as soon as it touches it.Bear with me,it really does work.



And this is what we`re using on the Sander.



Basically it is the same Material that is used on those Foam Pan Scrubbers,just bigger.Because it has no particles attached,like Sandpaper and other abrasive Sheets,this does not create the scratches in the surface which,if too deep,can be a pain to remove.instead,it gently wears away the Poly.The secret is not to apply excessive pressure,let the Machine do the work,that`s it`s job.It takes a while,but if you are patient,you should eventually get the surface finished as in the Pic below



A close up reveals that unlike abrasive Sheets,there are in fact,virtually no harsh sanding marks to worry about,



Ok,now you`ve got that far,how do we get a satisfactory finish ?.Something that will produce a nice mellow shine,that will also be able to have Fingermarks ect wiped from it.Matt finishes are,as you know,a pain to get marks off.I tried all kinds of Polish.I finaly found the one that filled all the requirements.Picture below,

.

Apply a thin layer of the Polish,and let it dry to a Haze,



The next step could be missed and you can go straight to hand polishing,but i used this surface attachment for the Sander,it is very very slightly abrasive,and starts to bring the Poly back to a subtle shine,



Which brings us to here,





Exactly the same method for the back,

Poly knocked back,



Then brought back to a finish,



The same idea with the Neck,but leaving it un polished,which has made it much much more playable,



Back to the Front.I applied another layer of Polish twice,but did not use the Sander,these 2 final stages are best done by hand.These Pictures are the finished results in the post below.I`ve included too many in one post

I hope this is of use to some of you.I have learned a lot,and made some great friends in the short time i`ve been here.I thought it would be good to give a little something back.

Rich

thank you for this tutorial.
I'd like to ask you one thing : did you also do the side of the guitar? is it the same process?
is this way good for all poly guitars?
thank you

[lefty1152]

0000 steel wool, even done lightly by hand looks like years of someone wiping the guitar with a dirty rag. I used Dunlop 65 polish after. I've gotta talk the custodian at work into saving the floor pad for me. I only did the back of the neck, but it already looks better. Well, except for the scratches.

I got a black roller bridge today and still waiting on the tailpiece, tuners, and pickups. It's gonna look so much better than it did with the chrome. It no longer looks like a toy.

[kmfp5150]

I tried this process with my Black Epi SG 66 and it failed miserably. I used the same equipment (B&D Mouse, 3M pads) as everybody else and didn't apply any pressure but it just left too many scratches & swirl marks for me to live with. My sander left tons of little scratches that look like spiral notebook wires or old school telephone cords.

Luckily I experimented on the back and was able to get the shine back by wet sanding it with 1000 grit then 1500 grit then a white 3M Final Finishing pad (p/n 10199NA at Lowe's) and a combo of turtle Wax Polishing compound and Meguiar's Scratch X 2.0.

I think this process is better suited for a clear coat poly over wood and not a solid finish, especially black.

[cilizal]

There are several black guits that have been dulled, in mi own experience I rather sand by hand with 1500 or even 2000 grit sand paper and the finish was excelent.

When I used the mouse I get scratches all around, when I start to get the shine back sanding with 1500 grit paper, I realice that the finish get dulled like I wanted first so I let it as it.

Originally Posted by kmfp5150

I tried this process with my Black Epi SG 66 and it failed miserably. I used the same equipment (B&D Mouse, 3M pads) as everybody else and didn't apply any pressure but it just left too many scratches & swirl marks for me to live with. My sander left tons of little scratches that look like spiral notebook wires or old school telephone cords.

Luckily I experimented on the back and was able to get the shine back by wet sanding it with 1000 grit then 1500 grit then a white 3M Final Finishing pad (p/n 10199NA at Lowe's) and a combo of turtle Wax Polishing compound and Meguiar's Scratch X 2.0.

I think this process is better suited for a clear coat poly over wood and not a solid finish, especially black.

[kmfp5150]

Originally Posted by cilizal

There are several black guits that have been dulled, in mi own experience I rather sand by hand with 1500 or even 2000 grit sand paper and the finish was excelent.

When I used the mouse I get scratches all around, when I start to get the shine back sanding with 1500 grit paper, I realice that the finish get dulled like I wanted first so I let it as it.

Yeah, I think I'm going to try it again and do it all by hand. I'm looking at getting the micro mesh finishing kit from stewmac.com with the super high grit pads. 1500 to 12000-grit.

When you sanded yours by hand, Did you go in a circular pattern or with the grain of the wood?

[cilizal]

I did it in small circules, but around the arm I couldn´t, so I did it back and foward. But the really really important stuff was that I use a wet sand paper. You don´t need a lot of water, but you have to soak the sand paper time to time to clean it and mantein it wet all time.

Originally Posted by cilizal

Finally got the desired texture, but still have not a good camera, sorry for the crappy pics.

Here you can see how it had scratches everywhere:


Here you can see that all that scratches removed:



How do I did it?? Well, I used a wet sanding technique, with a 1500 grit sandpaper and a little water, I sanded with my hands until completely erase scratches. It is no difficult and you can control well the presure applied.

[lefty1152]

[lefty1152]

My best results were from a red and white 3m pad, with a random orbital sander. Red pad used a couple of passes to get a nice, white, dusty, OMG, WHAT HAVE I DONE surface, and then clean with wet towel, followed by the white pad with Dunlop 65 polish. Polishing compound and swirl remover had grit that left scratch marks. Sand paper was too harsh, even down to 2500. I even tried toothpaste.

Some parts were pretty thin on this cheap POS, but I guess it adds to the "aged" look. I'm liking the black hardware. Now if I wasn't so tired with other things to do, I'd set up the strings and try out the new Wilkinson P-90's.

[kaafka]

I know it's probably not what you guys are used to, but I've already started the process on my Jaguar! So far, so good.

If you guys want pics, just let me know and I will take some.

[A4RTR]

Don't know if this has been asked yet, but has anyone given this a shot with a Mr Clean Magic Eraser? I'm wondering if it would be effective or not? I know when I cleaned the shiny finish on my white macbook, it made it a dull/flat finish, but not sure of it's effectiveness on poly. Any test dummies out there or folks that have given it a shot already?

[youngmarine101]

I want to do this soooo bad but Im worrying I will screw up really bad.

[beanx]

trust me you wont, i put it off for the longest time. Just get what you think are the right materials and try it out on a spot on the back of the guitar or on the back of the neck. The thing is as long as you dont eat into the veener or the wood, whatever you do can be buffed back to a shine. Dont put it off just do it, there is nothing to it just follow the OP's directions its as simple as it seems just let the sander do all the work.

[RealDyl]

Alright, I have a question for those of you who have successfully pulled this method of dulling off.

I am fixing to buy a black Ibanez RG2EX1 for a good deal, but part of the reason it is a good deal is becuse the body has been scratched up quite nicely. There aren't any scratches deep enough to the wood, so it's all in the poly. Now despite the fact the it is scratched up, I really like satin black guitars.

Now to the question; being that the poly is scratched up, would using this method to bring the guitar to a satin black pretty much eliminate most or all of the scratches?

If I can make the guitar a satin black and clean it up from scratches in the process, then this guitar would be absolutely beautiful, and a killer deal worth it.

Thanks for your help!

[cilizal]

IMO a killer deal always worth it, because the wood and electronics still there. If after wet sanding you didn´t get all scratches off, you can always paint your axe again. If you don´t know how to do it, I strongly recommend that ask for help to a professional luthier.

Good luck with your deal !!

Originally Posted by RealDyl

Alright, I have a question for those of you who have successfully pulled this method of dulling off.

I am fixing to buy a black Ibanez RG2EX1 for a good deal, but part of the reason it is a good deal is becuse the body has been scratched up quite nicely. There aren't any scratches deep enough to the wood, so it's all in the poly. Now despite the fact the it is scratched up, I really like satin black guitars.

Now to the question; being that the poly is scratched up, would using this method to bring the guitar to a satin black pretty much eliminate most or all of the scratches?

If I can make the guitar a satin black and clean it up from scratches in the process, then this guitar would be absolutely beautiful, and a killer deal worth it.

Thanks for your help!

[Publius]

What would you guys say is the best wax/polish for finishing this off? I'm trying this later and doing it by hand. Did the neck on an Epi Goldtop a while back and am now ready to do the rest!

[BoyatHeart]

I registered here as a result of finding this thread. The guitars in all these photos look amazing!

I'm seriously GAS'ing for an Epi Dot and I'll be looking into doing this on the finish as well as upgrading all the electrics and maybe the hardware too.

I'm interested to hear about anyone who has tried this technique on the finish and then either polished up to a moderate shine or applied some other laquer like nitro.

Still not sure what colour to get, but Cherry is looking like number one contender right now. After that a black Epi LP Standard would be nice too.

Really inspiring thread guys.

[dano8180]

Originally Posted by A4RTR

Don't know if this has been asked yet, but has anyone given this a shot with a Mr Clean Magic Eraser? I'm wondering if it would be effective or not? I know when I cleaned the shiny finish on my white macbook, it made it a dull/flat finish, but not sure of it's effectiveness on poly. Any test dummies out there or folks that have given it a shot already?

Tried it yesterday...no dice. Had to wipe it down afterwards with a microfiber cloth afterwards because it dried with water streaks, but no dulling effects.

[Rainbow Crayola]

If I had a Guitar I wasn't afraid of messing up... I would totally try this. Haha, might have to throw a little bit of cash at buying me a cheap LP copy just for the sake of doing this. Then get me some pups and new plastics and just mod that shizz up. XD Ahh, I'm in the mood to customize a Guitar... =D

CRAP. I just necro'd a thread didn't I? XD

[cilizal]

This thread should be sticky, a lot of views and a lot of good ideas here !! Don't be afraid to try, as I said before, you can always get the shine back, the poly finishes are very thick.

[sidious911]

Has anyone in Canada done this, and where did they find the materials that provided them with success?

I really want to attempt this but I am very hesitant as I really don't want to screw up my LP.

Cheers

EDIT: Is there a 'grit' rating on the pads that were used in the OP?

[EvolutionVII]

Thank you so much for this thread, I got me an Epi just to give this mod a shot:



It worked like a charm!

[msvsdoj]

Originally Posted by EvolutionVII

Thank you so much for this thread, I got me an Epi just to give this mod a shot:

It worked like a charm!

Looks great! Can you post before/after shots once you get the hardware on it?

[EvolutionVII]

Originally Posted by msvsdoj

Looks great! Can you post before/after shots once you get the hardware on it?

Thx!
I bough it without electronics and I got it like this:


This is her finished:


Here's another one:

[cilizal]

Looks great that top !!!

Originally Posted by EvolutionVII

Thank you so much for this thread, I got me an Epi just to give this mod a shot:



It worked like a charm!

[msvsdoj]

Looks great Evolution! Fantastic job and an excellent looking axe.

[backfromcali.]

Originally Posted by EvolutionVII

Thank you so much for this thread, I got me an Epi just to give this mod a shot:



It worked like a charm!

Awesome flame !!

[Carl17]

Has anyone done this on a black guitar? I wanna try it on my LP tribute but don't want to ruin it either so I'd like to see some pics.
Also, do you have to keep applying that Turtle Wax polish every so often or is it just one application and that's it?

[cilizal]

There are some post about black guits, after the process they stay awesome !! Try it over that tribute and post some pics.

[EvolutionVII]

Originally Posted by backfromcali.

Awesome flame !!

Thx, I posted a more detailed (german) tutorial here: [DIY] Epiphone Les Paul Lack matt schleifen

Originally Posted by Carl17

Has anyone done this on a black guitar? I wanna try it on my LP tribute but don't want to ruin it either so I'd like to see some pics.
Also, do you have to keep applying that Turtle Wax polish every so often or is it just one application and that's it?

It will be more flat black than satin imho:

[IanMak3103]

Originally Posted by EvolutionVII

Here's another one:

She looks really stunning!! Bravo!! Or shud I say Brava?!