And people say Epi's cant sound like Gibsons

[Seceded]

Just check this guy out

You Tube

You Tube

You Tube

You Tube

[RavenMadd]

its all in the mind......but nice point dude

[diceman]

I didn't know that people said that.

They sure can't FEEL like Gibsons, though.

[dudu]

With all due respect, they sound nothing like Gibsons, not in these clips anyway.
It's obviously also because of the amps they use. I'm not smug, my first LP was
a Vintage V100 that I still regard highly. In fact, I thought it sounded somewhat
closer to a Gibson than the Epiphones in the same price range I tried.

Let's be honest. Had the Epiphones really sounded like Gibsons, everyone here
would've bought 10 of them.

[River]

I'm with Dice, not dudu. They can sound precisely the same, in the mix and to the audience - as much as any two guitars can. Big whoop.

They do not look and feel the same, and Gibson makes damned sure they don't.

[dudu]

I actually agree with you, River. A mix is a deceiving beast. After you've
finished cutting every guitar frequency that makes your recording sound
crowded there isn't much of a difference between the two. Live mixes are
loud enough to trick the ear into thinking they sound the same. But what
happens back home when it's just you, the guitar and the amp is a quite
different story.

Again, I'm not bashing Epis. My ears say they don't sound like Gibsons. I
certainly wish they did. Instead of one guitar I'd afford several.

[diceman]

My beloved Epiphone sounds fantastic (there is no "like a Gibson" - that is a boner of a benchmark). It feels like an Epiphone, though. Not like a Gibson. Markedly different. It plays as good as any guitar I've ever owned - because a setup is more important than the quality of materials used in its construction when it comes to playability.

[River]

Originally Posted by dudu

I actually agree with you, River. A mix is a deceiving beast. After you've finished cutting every guitar frequency that makes your recording sound crowded there isn't much of a difference between the two. Live mixes are loud enough to trick the ear into thinking they sound the same. But what happens back home when it's just you, the guitar and the amp is a quite different story.

Again, I'm not bashing Epis. My ears say they don't sound like Gibsons. I
certainly wish they did. Instead of one guitar I'd afford several.

All good. I didn't take you as bashing.

My only Epi is a Junior, with a pickup upgrade. I honestly can't hear a qualitative difference between it and its older brother Gibson - i.e., there are differences, but one's not better than the other, just slightly different. If I record them on the left and right channels, I can hear those differences, if only slightly. Add the drums and bass and poof!

But the feel and eye candy! They ARE worth the extra money, if you have it.

[River]

Originally Posted by diceman

...because a setup is more important than the quality of materials used in its construction when it comes to playability.

Righty-oh, and by far.

[Sirzach]

The biggest thing that people get caught up on is that it doesn't need to sound like a gibson to sound good.

My epi doesn't sound like a gibson, but it sure doesn't sound like shit either.

[dudu]

I was pointing out quantitative, not qualitative differences

[River]

Originally Posted by dudu

I was pointing out quantitative, not qualitative differences

Gotcha.

Keep in mind I'm the guy who ran the "Five Guitars" blind tests here, plugged and unplugged, and people couldn't even identify the Tele from the R8, Standard, and Junior, much less the Gibsons from the Epiphone. I didn't go into that trying to trick anyone, and didn't even change amp settings. That's where my opinion on this subject comes from.

[tolm]

I have an Epi Dot and a Gibson LP R8 costing approximately 10x as much. The Gibson definitely has a more 'solid' feel to it - and I don't just mean because it's a solid-body rather than a semi. It just feels better put together, from better materials. The finish on the Gibson is far nicer, too - much less 'coated in plastic' than the Epi. However, the Epi - perhaps because it's a semi - exudes a certain class that makes me want to pick it up and play whenever I walk past. Or maybe it's just that it's out on a stand whilst the Gibson is safely stored in it's case, away from mischievous kids ...



With a decent setup and identical strings - they are both fabulous guitars to play and own. Obviously, they sound different but the Gibson LP also has a much fatter tone than my old Epi LP too. Not necessarily better - depends what you're trying to play - but certainly not the same.

Would I pass River's 'blind' test? I'm not sure, but I'd like to think I could tell the difference between my Tele and my R8, at least!

[Spirithawk]

Why worry? Be happy! I look at it like this, they each sound great, just a tad differant. Therefore a person might easily prefer the sound of one over the other while the next person prefers the oposite. If my Epi Standard Plus Top were any easier to play it wouldn't need me it would play itself. If I could afford one I'd love a Gibson, but I can't, and I'm quite satisfied with my Epiphone. Bottom line? I think in every guitar make and model you'll find good ones and bad ones so therefore I say some Epiphones can sound as good or better than some Gibsons. As Lilly Tomlin would say, "And that's the truth!"

[River]

Originally Posted by tolm

Would I pass River's 'blind' test? I'm not sure, but I'd like to think I could tell the difference between my Tele and my R8, at least!

Blind tests are shockers, man. We listen with our eyes and, to a lesser degree, our fingers much more than we want to believe.

By purposely not labeling and random-shuffling the tracks, I chose MY OWN '92 Standard as MY OWN Tele in a test I conducted on myself.

Now, with some settings the Tele is as obvious as a black period on white paper, but play with as much dirt as the vast majority of us here play, and all bets are off.

[tolm]

Originally Posted by River

Blind tests are shockers, man. We listen with our eyes and, to a lesser degree, our fingers much more than we want to believe.

By purposely not labeling and random-shuffling the tracks, I chose MY OWN '92 Standard as MY OWN Tele in a test I conducted on myself.

Ah - listening, not playing?! Okay, yeh, that'd be more tricky. I was thinking I'd have a fighting chance of knowing if I was playing an Epi LP or a Gibson LP from the feel (no checking headstock shape - cheaters!) but just from a recording? Less confident ...

[wreckingball]

Originally Posted by diceman

snip>They sure can't FEEL like Gibsons, though.

Care to elaborate?

Yes, I know I could go out to a guitar shop anywhere, and check this out for myself, but I would like to know what differences you notice...

Not asking you to write a book, just name a couple of major differences that you notice, short and sweet, I'll catch your drift...

Thanks in advance

*edit* this goes to anyone who has played both Epis and Gibsons

[River]

Originally Posted by wreckingball

Care to elaborate?

*edit* this goes to anyone who has played both Epis and Gibsons

Nitro feels like a silk shirt compared to a 70-30 Cotton-Polyester blend. It feels like...money. Like suede compared to latex.

Now, poly CAN be made to feel like that, but that jacks up the price and Gibson has no interest in closing the gap.

That's IT as far as I'm concerned. Others will tell you they can feel better fret ends, sloppy binding edges, etc., etc. I don't buy it. Again, blind tests would prove my point, I'll bet you a Wildwood R9.

But that nitro is something. Even my $500 un-filled, un-polished Melody Maker V feels, well, more expensive than my arguably nicer Ibanez Jet King.

YouTube - ‪Old Spice Commercial ft Bruce Campbell‬‏

YouTube - ‪Old Spice Commercial ft Bruce Campbell‬‏

(Where it says "Experience" at the end, substitute "Nitro".)

[wreckingball]

Thanks, Riv'... Nuff said, I guess...

[Thumpalumpacus]

Originally Posted by wreckingball

Care to elaborate?

Yes, I know I could go out to a guitar shop anywhere, and check this out for myself, but I would like to know what differences you notice...

Not asking you to write a book, just name a couple of major differences that you notice, short and sweet, I'll catch your drift...

Thanks in advance

*edit* this goes to anyone who has played both Epis and Gibsons

My Epi G400 plays just as well as does my Gibby Faded. It has a sleeker neck, but with its glossy finish, it's a sticky thing when the playing gets hot and heavy. That, however, isn't brand-specific. The Epi's fretwork is smoother than the Gibby's, but that could well be a matter of being twenty years older.

The only differences in build:

Epi: 3 piece neck, five, count 'em five piece body, epi bridge, and of course the headstock is a narrow book, not a wide one.

Gibby: Aside from the above, it's got a D-neck, nice round shoulders, which I love, and much better pickups. I replaced the stock bridge with a skinny All-parts so the strings would clear the backside of it.

The Epi can sound like the Gibby with a little care, but really, I like them for different reasons. The Gibby has a more open midrange, where the Epi has kerrang! out the ass. They're both cool. The Gibby is my #1, because it's more versatile, and doesn't have a microphonic bridge pickup.

[snaredrum]

my epis have open book headstock, me's happy

[wreckingball]

Originally Posted by snaredrum

my epis have open book headstock, me's happy

Whoa! You have a different kind of Epi... that side of the pond?

Your experience runs contrary to Thump's, is that correct?

You care to elaborate, Snares?

*edit* or are you just pullin' my chain?

[River]

Originally Posted by wreckingball

Whoa! You have a different kind of Epi... that side of the pond?

Your experience runs contrary to Thump's, is that correct?

You care to elaborate, Snares?

*edit* or are you pullin' my chain?

Snaresy's into big boobs, cleavage, and pedals. Take due notice thereof, and consider his opinions accordingly.

[wreckingball]

[Thumpalumpacus]

Originally Posted by snaredrum

my epis have open book headstock, me's happy

Yeah, I hate that damned tombstone they're using now. My 89 is top-heavy enough with the little narrow-book. I could just imagine it with one of those monstrosities on it.

That reminds me, another big difference: my Epi does the neck-dive, but my Gibson is finely balanced.

[snaredrum]

Originally Posted by River

Snaresy's into big boobs, cleavage, and pedals. Take due notice thereof, and consider his opinions accordingly.

although given my current strike rate it's pretty much pedals, pedals, and crying about not seeing boobs enough. although drinking in a pub that has a high student quota certainly helps

[snaredrum]

Originally Posted by wreckingball

Whoa! You have a different kind of Epi... that side of the pond?

Your experience runs contrary to Thump's, is that correct?

You care to elaborate, Snares?

*edit* or are you just pullin' my chain?

i have some MIJ epis. that wonderful mystical grey area between Epi and Gibson...

[dave-m]

Least important componet of your tone is the lettering on the headstock. I'm with the others, Epi's can sound as good as Gibson's, they can play as good as Gibson's but they rarely feel as good. Nitro beats poly any day of the week.

I own/play four Epi's and one MiM Strat so I'm hardly a cork sniffer, but Gibson's just feel better. I do own a Gibson Les Paul, but it's been in a humidity controlled display case since 1988. I just started playing again about 18 months ago and haven't felt the need to use the Gibson.

[wreckingball]

Originally Posted by snaredrum

i have some MIJ epis. that wonderful mystical grey area between Epi and Gibson...

Well now, that settles everything, doesn't it?... 'Wonderful, Grey, and Mystical' being so empirical and all...

Just kidding Snares... Thanks for the info...

[diceman]

Nitro and Poly feel different. Not better or worse, different. A poly finished Epi won't "feel" like a nitro finished Gibson.